In 2004, I thought Howard Dean should have had the chance to win over the US-presidential contest. He was a doctor and governor, albeit of a smaller state, who not only said that going into Iraq was a mistake, but also saw it as an achievable objective to reduce the growth rate of the federal government medical liabilities from 10% to 6% a year. His Iowa scream was so much blown out of any proportion that John Kerry followed him as the best face on a Democratic comeback.
I had grown to like Kerry and hoped he'd win. Then we had to whole presidential election being decided by the Ohio vote, or so most of us thought/saw. Several reports about vote-irregularities came up, after (while?) Kerry hastily conceded to the official count, in Ohio. This did not feel right and left many unanswered questions about the whole Kerry candidacy.
In retrospect, Kerry's indecisively countering the swift-boat allegations is at odds with his principled positions during the Vietnam War. Yeah, he conveniently had the Shrum-curse to fall on for the swift-boat episode, but that should have been a personal matter rather than political maneuvering and calculation for somebody like him.
As for Kerry's flip-flopping on the Iraq War, one should only ask: Why is it that people look at this as a relief of sorts for his fall? At least, one can argue that opinions change with the facts or evidence.
The latest straw, which also broke Kerry's moral high ground, came with the occasion of the Senate debates on taxing private equity funds that go IPO. Why is it that Kerry (and Schumer, for that matter) are not in favor of such tax? Is it revealing of principled action or the true nature of the politiko?
I had grown to like Kerry and hoped he'd win. Then we had to whole presidential election being decided by the Ohio vote, or so most of us thought/saw. Several reports about vote-irregularities came up, after (while?) Kerry hastily conceded to the official count, in Ohio. This did not feel right and left many unanswered questions about the whole Kerry candidacy.
In retrospect, Kerry's indecisively countering the swift-boat allegations is at odds with his principled positions during the Vietnam War. Yeah, he conveniently had the Shrum-curse to fall on for the swift-boat episode, but that should have been a personal matter rather than political maneuvering and calculation for somebody like him.
As for Kerry's flip-flopping on the Iraq War, one should only ask: Why is it that people look at this as a relief of sorts for his fall? At least, one can argue that opinions change with the facts or evidence.
The latest straw, which also broke Kerry's moral high ground, came with the occasion of the Senate debates on taxing private equity funds that go IPO. Why is it that Kerry (and Schumer, for that matter) are not in favor of such tax? Is it revealing of principled action or the true nature of the politiko?
September 18, 2007
Here's another angle on the whole Kerry affair:
3 comments:
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1.
September 18th,
2007
10:15 am
Those officers were idiots. The student’s repeated shouts, “Don’t tase me,” amounted to a “Don’t throw me into that briar patch” tactic, and it worked.
There were six police officers on top of the guy by the time they used the taser. Why can’t six officers (a few of them quite large) escort one college student out of the building without further incident?
The student was obviously very media-saavy. A loud, senseless rant in a college auditorium plus indiscriminate use of force equals a nation-wide media event.
— Posted by Kit
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2.
September 18th,
2007
10:33 am
This guy continued to struggle after repeated warnings from the police. He had many, many chances to quiet down and walk out, and he didn’t take them. He wanted to make a spectacle of himself, and he succeeded.
— Posted by Jon
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3.
September 18th,
2007
10:45 am
Of course we don’t get to hear Kerry’s answers to the questions (at least on the YouTube clip linked to this article.)
It’s absurd that American’s are afraid of a student asking pointed questions of a political leader and further that many condone using a taser on an unarmed person. What has happened to our democracy when the opposition won’t oppose? And worse, when they’re not held accountable?
— Posted by Diamond
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4.
September 18th,
2007
10:54 am
If these scenes were from a South American, Middle Eastern, or Asian country, most Americans would feel a bit of disgust and then thankfulness they don’t live there. Most Americans are not proud of the images from 40 years ago onward of police and student interactions.
That said, controlling public events, be they political speeches, protest rallies, or wet T-shirt contests (even bad taste deserves some protection) is necessary, and the police get the nod to make this happen. However, despite their training, they do remain human beings with their own feelings, thoughts and opinions. We might be correct to believe that when a group of them, as in the video and as in events 40 years ago and in between, behave in lockstep that it is part of an attitude from the leadership on down, the (un?)spoken general attitudes.
We forget history’s lessons far too easily and quickly. Remember J. Edgar Hoover and what he did through the FBI? Then it was the threat of communism. The invasion was imminent, the bombs more so. Today it is another threat, perhaps a bit more tangible, but the results are not being played out much differently.
Maybe some good will come from this. Unlike 40 years ago, when students in overwhelming numbers showed their political bent (even if not fully correct or matured, but still passionate), today’s students are listening to iPods and text messaging at the malls. They need a wakeup call.
They should also keep their eyes opened until well in adulthood though. Much of the political riff and strife today comes from plots hatched on college campuses in the 1960s or so, much has been about revenge and getting even. that is a history lesson that today’s kids should not forget, either.
— Posted by Raising Cane
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5.
September 18th,
2007
10:55 am
Imagine Meyers was treated worst than an animal in front of many witness including a current senator/former presidential candidate. He was even on the senator’s side. Can you imagine what the cops does to poor blacks in the absence of witnesses? Thanks Meyers!.
— Posted by dadland
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6.
September 18th,
2007
10:59 am
The reaction would be completely different if the police had tasered a loud-mouthed liberal who was confronting a conservative Republican politician. In that case, we would be treated to endless commentary about police brutality, political suppression, the loss of First Amendment rights, ad nauseum, from such publicity hounds as Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, et al.
— Posted by John Gleason
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7.
September 18th,
2007
11:07 am
Restraining a struglling individual is not just a matter of size and strength - anyone who has ever wrestled a 2 year old having a tantrum should know as much. And when the individual is not 2, but a fully grown man, there is serious danger to someone trying to subdue said individual. Even the random flail of an arm could break a nose. Why should an officer be required to risk serious bodily harm because someone else makes the choice to disobey the officers order. Even more importantly using brute strength to force Andrew’s arms behind his back is likely to result in injuries to Anrdrew with strained shoulders, elbowes, ro even a broken limb.
If Andrew doesn’t want to be tasered, but register protest, he can go totally limp. It is an effective and annoying strategy. Oh, and he could keep yelling the whole time.
— Posted by japruf
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8.
September 18th,
2007
11:08 am
What is clear is that the police should be the ones in the dock, not Andrew Meyer. They have a lot to answer for. I see Andrew Meyer winning a lot of money out of this.
— Posted by Matt Marazios
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9.
September 18th,
2007
11:13 am
In my opinion, simply unacceptable in a so called “democratic” society.
— Posted by angry
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10.
September 18th,
2007
11:14 am
Help! Help! I’m being repressed! Come see the violence inherent in the system!
It’s not that he was asking pointed questions - he was being overly disruptive and annoying. And, I saw on one news report that Kerry continued answering his questions while he was being tasered.
— Posted by Stephen
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11.
September 18th,
2007
11:25 am
Isn’t this the definition of Kafka-esque? OK, the kid is a boor; however, this response is completely surreal and beyond my worst imagination!
After seeing “harmless” Taser use in this case, anyone have second thoughts about the quality of a Florida education? Conflict resolution is obviously not part of the official lexicon.
— Posted by A former Kerry voter
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12.
September 18th,
2007
11:29 am
What’s so wrong with asking questions? Will someone tell me what this citizen did wrong? Is being annoying enough to get tazzed? In the footage I’ve seen, he was never even asked to leave. The police simply siezed him when they tired of his whines…no warning, tap on the shoulder to step down, or anything. Seems quite illegal, especially at a public forum.
— Posted by dingo
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13.
September 18th,
2007
11:31 am
someone just blew the ‘pig pile’ whistle
— Posted by dougk
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14.
September 18th,
2007
11:35 am
Again, one is left in wonderment as to what it is that the US superpower thinks it has that is so good that they should impose it on other nations in the world, and with the full weight of its armaments.
I thought freedom of speech was even more important than the good old right to bear arms, and freely use them, as happened here.
What has happened in the US?
These (university?) police should be held fully accountable.
Blackwater should be held accountable too.
— Posted by Shocked.
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15.
September 18th,
2007
11:38 am
The students should have ripped those officers limb from limb and scattered their bleeding limbs across the campus green.
— Posted by asdfasdf
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16.
September 18th,
2007
11:39 am
A Constitutional Law professor of mine at BGSU always told our class to question authority. After millions of students watch this via the Times or Youtube, how many do think are going to want to question authority now?
— Posted by Jeffrey
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17.
September 18th,
2007
11:41 am
Jon,
If a guy is disturbing some event by his exercise of free speech, OK, throw him out. Saying he brought the tasering upon himself by protesting or continuing with his questioning is the height of ignorance. By that reasoning, do you also think the black student lunch-counter protesters in the early 60’s would’ve been fairly treated with a shot to the back of the head?
Nice sense of history you’ve go there, Jon.
— Posted by Phil
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18.
September 18th,
2007
11:41 am
The cops should’ve shown a little more restraint. Still, the guy is such a punk that I would’ve tased him on general principal. Suspend the cops for a few days and then send ‘em back on the job.
— Posted by Richard Thomas
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19.
September 18th,
2007
11:44 am
i was always taught (correctly) that when a cop — even a campus cop — gives you an order or tries to usher you out of an auditorium, you don’t resist.
if you have a problem with the cop, you take it up administratively, after the fact.
that’s not just common sense. it’s the entire basis for the rule of law in a civil society.
— Posted by anonymous
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20.
September 18th,
2007
11:50 am
Wow, and KERRY JUST KEEPS TALKING!Maybe some candidates DO remember our consitutional rights, like RON PAUL!
FREE THIS MAN!
— Posted by John
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21.
September 18th,
2007
11:51 am
Outrageous that this kid was tasered when they clearly should have simply shot him.
That’d tone down these rambunctious protesters, don’t you think? Then he really would be a martyr too.
Just kidding of course, Bush hasn’t pushed us that far into fascism yet. If this kid had been annoying in Myanmar tho, that would have been the result. So maybe he should contemplate how he’s lucky to have gotten off without injury, and avoid being quite so obnoxious in future.
— Posted by Dan Stackhouse
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22.
September 18th,
2007
11:52 am
The sad part is that this is what political oppposition is today. Pundits profiteer on discontent while their meager protests sit quietly on a shelf in Barnes & Noble. Meanwhile, common folks and misguided students who get angry enough to say something marginalize themselves with spectacles like this one. Here we are getting ready to debate the police reaction, but what we should be wondering is:
What are the answers to Mr. Meyer’s poorly posited but well-intended questions? Why did Kerry, and for that matter every American citizen, not push for a full investigation of the 2004 election? The fact that the most divisive and potentially most unsuccessful president in our history was put and kept in office by two elections with serious legitimacy issues should be of the gravest concern.
A lot of things should be of the gravest concern for that matter. But if Mr. Meyer and the few kids heard saying “Rodney King” on the tape are any indication, the few of us who are brave enough to speak up are also foolhardy and out of touch enough not to know what to say.
— Posted by Russell
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23.
September 18th,
2007
11:58 am
Give people too much power and watch the result. For example: Bush, Cheyney, the FBI, the NSA and the POLICE, to name a few.
Our Founding Fathers considered the militia dangerous but necessary, and they understood that power corrupts. In the Constitution, freedom is the primary concern. Watch out for people who say they are going to make you “safe” (e.g., Hitler, Franco, Bush and the police).
We have come a long way in the wrong direction since James Madison in our perceptions and actions.
— Posted by ralph tyler
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24.
September 18th,
2007
11:59 am
We give high school dropouts guns, badges and tasers and some people are shocked that this is the result. What’s appalling is that some people approve of the the cops’ reaction.
— Posted by Not Surprised
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25.
September 18th,
2007
12:00 pm
Looks like FREE SPEECH is dead in the USA (along with “Democracy”).
Americans will either have to get used to having ONE political party with 2 faces, and living in a police state - or they can do something about it!
Wake-up America!
— Posted by MadAsHell
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26.
September 18th,
2007
12:03 pm
Re read 14.
_______
— Posted by ab irato
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27.
September 18th,
2007
12:06 pm
The dismissive tone in this blog is unbelievable. Being disruptive at a political event shouldn’t be considered an act of martyrdom. Raucous debate and tough questions are what politics is supposed to be about.
Even in Britain — hardly a banana republic — they have Prime Minister’s Questions every week, where the PM gets treated a hundred times worse than Kerry did here, by other politicians on live TV. What can we learn from blow-dried automatons answering softball questions in a quiet auditorium?
Most of all, I’m angry at the liberals who would make excuses for this kind of thing. I have more respect for right-wingers who would give up their freedom for safety, than I do for liberals who would give up their freedom for respectability.
— Posted by dylan
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28.
September 18th,
2007
12:07 pm
Oh, please. It’s called resisting arrest. If the kid had left when the cops told him to, they probably would have dropped all charges. Instead, he eluded police and obviously resisted arrest. I don’t care if you’re Republican, Democrat or neither, in this country, that’s a crime. End of story.
— Posted by Jay
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29.
September 18th,
2007
12:14 pm
What struck me immediately, is (and I was a Kerry supporter) why didn’t the former Navy boat captain say something to stop it?
Though we have many disturbing messages these days about how the heart and soul of the country is going or gone, this one may be the most disturbing I have seen.
It is disturbing not because of the physical actions, but because our leaders aren’t capable of even stopping a small human event.
All Kerry had to do was ask the police to stop (he had the microphone) and answer the kid.
Most frightening is can you think of another politician who would have done anything different than what Kerry did?
— Posted by John Bollinger
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30.
September 18th,
2007
12:14 pm
Police Brutality, Tyranny, & Oppression.
The Noose Begins To Tighten.
— Posted by American_Slave
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31.
September 18th,
2007
12:16 pm
Isn’t it obvious to any one who has seen the video that Meyer had planned every element of the confrontation. Anyone who has attended ANY kind of forum knows that you ask a quick question or two and then return to your seat. The police would not be standing behind him if he had been only asking a “few” questions. The video starts with the police already standing behind the kid. He had obviously “worn out his welcome” long before someone began video tapeing and the police were called in to remove him. When, attending a forum, you are asked to present your question(s) and then sit down to let others participate. You risk being expelled from the proceedings if you don’t follow the rules. Apply the same idea to a baseball game when the umpire ejects a manager or player. oh, but amazing enough “blockhead” athletes seem to have a bit more class than Andrew Meyer. I’ve never seen the umpires have to remove someone by force - but I don’t really believe that’s what happened here. Meyer got exactly what he wanted… a lawsuit setup that is broadcast loud and clear to anyone, anywhere - world wide witnesses (funny there’s no video prior to the police taking action…)
In case anyone thinks that I’m a right wing, pro-police, nutjob - you are wrong. I wouldn’t vote Republican if they offered me lots of money. It’s that I’ve seen these kinds of “games” before. The truth is that the “conspiracy” and generally stupid questions he asked were to agitate Kerry and whoever else was in charge. He went on and on to annoy and stir up the crowd. When the police were called and arrived he became louder and more agitated which puts the police into an alert state. When the police say “it’s time to leave”, you leave - no idiot screams, no “what did I do’s”, - you leave, UNLESS you are willing to face and receive the consequences - THAT IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU ARE PROTESTING FOR YOU IDEALS. Old School concept: “…and damn the consequences!” That’s what make protesting the system suppost to be so profound and heartfelt - The threat of reprisal - The sense that you believe something so much that you would risk bodily harm to have your voice heard. Mr. Meyer, from what I saw and heard in this story, only risks bodily harm when he sees the opportunity to present “police brutality” in the public eye and in a place that is easily “of his choosing”. No doubt he’ll win the lawsuit in our politically correct system - there is no longer a sense of personal responsibility. Con artists set up the soft system and are willing to “risk bodily harm” for a few million bucks all the time - wouldn’t you?……
Oh and also, the idea that someone is “helpless” when unarmed is just plain old stupid.
— Posted by jpeterson
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32.
September 18th,
2007
12:19 pm
He got what he deserved for infringing on other’s right to freedom of assembly.
— Posted by Andy
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33.
September 18th,
2007
12:23 pm
I am against the police tazing this guy, but nor do I yet believe they actually did. What I see and hear in that video is a blowhard college student doing everything in his power to call attention to himself and make this a bigger incident than it needed to be. His whole rant, along with all the screams, seems scripted and forced.
— Posted by Darren J. Schmidt
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34.
September 18th,
2007
12:23 pm
Don’t post too long comment on this news or police have to use the taser on you
— Posted by Francesco
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35.
September 18th,
2007
12:40 pm
The earlier post which states this in regard to obeying a police officer is wrong and fundamentaly uninformed:
“…that’s not just common sense. it’s the entire basis for the rule of law in a civil society.”
Free citizens in a free society do not have to obey a police officer if the order being given is not lawful and there is no imminent threat to public safety. If police can shutdown debate by simply walking up to anyone in a public gathering and ordering them to leave, we do not have a free society and public gatherings would be useless. Democracy is not a neat, orderly affair. It is supposed to allow dissent.
The gatherings promoted by president Bush, on the other hand, are purposefully created to be “private events” so that the organizers may remove, for any purpose, anyone they don’t like being there. This practice, which is contrary to the spirit of public debate and against what our nation’s founder’s believed, has probably created some confusion, especially among police officers who have seen and heard many people being removed from “rallies” organized by the White House and Republicans. These forums are shame events and do not represent open democracy, but rather a Disney-fied version.
TASERS should be banned. While they might seem to be reasonable tools in the hands of respectful and careful police officers, they are, at base, weapons of fascist dreams. They give police the ability to inflict disabling wounds on anyone they choose, at any time, without the stigma of gunshots. The potential for abuse is vast and will be evident in many ways in the coming years. They are being promoted for greed and profit, but they have the potential to undermine the basis of our democracy. In less dramatic terms, they are injuring thousands of citizens unnecessarily.
— Posted by Doug Terry terryreport.com
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36.
September 18th,
2007
12:41 pm
Ah Florida— the state that stole the 1980 election had decided to eliminate freedom of speech and not having to worry about excessive force being used against them for nonviolent conduct.
Society is sitting by as police forces are arming themselves with all kinds of high tech gadgetry in order that they can “protect” the citizens. Who will protect us from the Putin-like tactics of police departments like the one in Florida? How is it that about 6 police officers can show up at a university event in a matter of minutes to “quell” a windbag student from taking up too much time at a microphone? Is being a long-winded bore enough of a “crime” to merit such an abusive?
Our rights are being erroded and the responses here about “he had it coming” only further undermines our freedoms.
— Posted by Hedd Wyn
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37.
September 18th,
2007
12:41 pm
Further proof, if any were needed, that the term “police brutality” is redundant.
— Posted by JIM Cory
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38.
September 18th,
2007
12:45 pm
Ironically, yesterday was US Constitution Day.
— Posted by Jilly
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39.
September 18th,
2007
12:51 pm
After reading several articles on this today and watching the youtube videos, I still believe the police were in the wrong. The female officer standing behind him in the video here, interferes only 32 seconds after he begins. Granted none of the videos show any of the proceedings prior to this student, but what gives her the right to interfere if he is allowed the full one minute to ask a question. In total his question ran 1 min 35 seconds. If she hadn’t interfered, it could’ve easily been asked within the time limit regardless of whether people agreed with the validity of the content.
The female officer and her counterpart obviously were not going to let this person leave of his own volition. When he threw his hands in the air and backed away they were still grabbing at him. Considering the word “arrest” was muttered immediately after the mic was turned off, he never would have had that chance anyways.
I don’t disagree that the student wasn’t entirely to blame. But that female officer should be reprimanded or dismissed along with the officer who used the Taser after the student was being held on the floor.
— Posted by Jaclyn
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40.
September 18th,
2007
12:52 pm
John Bollinger you hit the nail on the head. Aren’t elected officials, no less candidates for president, supposed to represent their contingencies and communicate with them? It surprised me greatly to see that a man who wanted to reach out to all parts of the American public to become its leader could not quiet the likes of a 22 year-old polisci undergrad. Obviously the kid was being overly obnoxious, but he, just as we all do, has the right and the obligation to question his government. It is truly absurd that at functions like these people are not allowed to ask real questions, raise real issues, or get real answers.
— Posted by amazed
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41.
September 18th,
2007
12:56 pm
Did Kerry intervene or protest? Not when he “won” the 2004 election or when–at his show–Meyer gets suppressed.
More important, what did the rest of the students do? In my day, they would have wrested Meyer from the police. (My day was the 60’s, but solidarity has no time period).
We can all view the overthrow of the constitution on YouTube. Seems like I’m watching a Prime Time TV show. Too bad it’s real.
— Posted by John McMullen
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42.
September 18th,
2007
12:56 pm
Meyer badgers Kerry with a stupid question and has no remote interest in listening to what Kerry has to say. What a jerk. The juggernaut that put Bush into office would not have stopped no matter what Kerry could or would have said. Meyer is a manipulator. He would fit nicely in with the Bush administration.
— Posted by Thomas Weden
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43.
September 18th,
2007
12:57 pm
To the people who think he “deserved” it for not calming down and leaving when he was told to do so: can you imagine have five large, armed people attack you, drag you out of the room, and restrain you, while a room full of people watch? Can you even comprehend the panic and fear that will produce? Does it even matter to you that this little guy was actually NOT resisting when they tasered him - he was in fact simply begging them not to shoot him with the gun?
How people can defend such senseless brutality is beyond me.
— Posted by Matt
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44.
September 18th,
2007
12:58 pm
Dear 32,
Really? Please explain how, exactly, being a loudmouth at an open mic infringes on others’ rights to freedom of assembly.
— Posted by Theodore J. Sawchuck
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45.
September 18th,
2007
1:02 pm
The First Amendment protects everyone’s right to as “annoying” questions. The whole point of the First Amendment protecting freedom of speech, is to prevent any state action that judges the content of a person’s speech. What happened here is the perfect case in point. It is not for the police to decide whether or not the questioner should be allowed to continue his line of questioning. His critical, and ranty line of questioning is very common at any of these type of events. There is always someone who goes on too long, bores everyone else, and doesn’t ever even get to the question… however this student was not even being disrespectful. He was asking critical, and important questions, while making a valid, albeit long preface, to a public official. It is shameful that Kerry did not intervene in the student’s arrest. The police’s action was utterly Un-American, and unconstitutional. I think we are importing more than just cheap goods from China, we also seem to be importing cheap ideas.
— Posted by Ben
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46.
September 18th,
2007
1:02 pm
This incident comes a week after a reverend was tackled by cops (who broke his leg) in the halls of congress just for waiting in line to get into the hearings. Obviously the level of brutality which cops are given liscence to exercise is out of hand. The fact that so many Americans approve of this behaviour is outragous. WAKE UP! We are turning into a police state.
I’d also like to point out that the cops didn’t pounce until Andrew Meyeres mentioned Skull and Bones. That’s ominous.
— Posted by brendan cooney
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47.
September 18th,
2007
1:04 pm
Many of the posters on this topic fail to realize that citizens in a free, democratic society have rights that are greater than those of police officers. Of course, when push comes to shove, one is better off not pushing back and taking the matter to court. There are times, however, when even someone so learned and respected as Thomas Jefferson might have found it necessary to resist.
A lawful citizen disobeying an unlawful order by a police officer is not breaking the law. Is this so difficult to understand? The police are not our parents.
One should note on the video that the at least three police officers came around the speaker almost immediately, before he extended his remarks and before there was any disruption.
The rights of citizens extend even to the right of self defense in extreme situations. These rights are the fundamental basis of how our country differs not only from ancient kingdoms, but existing legal structures around the world, including Europe today. In France, for example, you can be held in jail for a one year period without formal charges. England does not have a constitution and, therefore, does not have a constitutional Bill of Rights against which the actions of police can be judged. (Our own rights were based on those emerging in England, but it is significant that ours are codified formally.)
At what point does making a speech from the audience become disruptive or represent “disturbing the peace”? In this case, at the point when the police officers grabbed the speaker. The entire meeting was disrupted. In most cases, the audience would “encourage” an over extended questioner to shut up and sit down without police assistance.
— Posted by Doug Terry terryreport.com
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48.
September 18th,
2007
1:11 pm
Was the student tasered, or did he just have a fit of hubris?
— Posted by J. Goldberg
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49.
September 18th,
2007
1:16 pm
Police officers live and die by their ability to guess likelihood of escalation. To a police officer, the choice may come down to “would I rather take the heat for using non-lethal but disabling force, or would I rather take the heat for an assassination attempt on a national politician–in case that’s what this guy is up to?” Cops need situational authority. People who aren’t cooperating are forcing the cop to click through an escalation of tactics, while assessing four jillion variables at the same time, especially in crowds. They probably knew they were being decoyed into the taser use. It’s just political theater, and the thespian–Meyer in this case–read his part perfectly to force the escalation. BTW, I graduated from University of Florida in 1967, and knew many of the campus radicals. This is right out of their playbook.
— Posted by Geronimo
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50.
September 18th,
2007
1:16 pm
Police officers to stop a self-indulgent rant? What do you think faculty do in a classroom? Call security everyday? Please. Stupid, stupid, stupid.They should have just taken the microphone away from him instead and let the crowd shout him down. By the way, if I am wrestled away from a microphone during a public forum by five police officers, I too might be inclined to yell and struggle.
— Posted by Becks
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51.
September 18th,
2007
1:16 pm
Tase Andrew Meyer!
— Posted by A True Conservative
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52.
September 18th,
2007
1:23 pm
Cowboy Fascism. It’s the American way.
If you don’t love it, leave it. Let this song I’m singing be a warning. When you’re running down my country man, you’re walking on the fightin’ side of me.
— Posted by Kacoo
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53.
September 18th,
2007
1:23 pm
American politicians always have these stage managed events so they can avoid difficult questions, or give vapid answers without being shouted down. In this respect, Kerry is no different from George “Mission Accomplished” Bush on his aircraft carrier. Kerry even had people arrested for holding up anti-war signs at the 2004 Democratic convention.
I’m sorry, but if you have to be a jerk to cut through that, then being a jerk is called for. Too much is at stake. If the guy had asked his question politely, sat down, and listened to Kerry spew a few minutes of hot air, no one would be better off, and we wouldn’t even be talking about this issue on the national stage.
His intention was to put a difficult question to Kerry and to get the world to see, and he succeeded pretty marvelously. In the act, he also showed us the kind of violence that even liberals will use to keep their events scripted and uncontroversial. It’s a valuable lesson. Who cares if he “alienated” people? When we look back at the Iraq war, will we remember the number of impeccable stump speeches that discreetly ignored it, or the people who raised hell to end it?
— Posted by dylan
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54.
September 18th,
2007
1:25 pm
Unbelievable. Those officers better get charged with something. Tasing an unarmed student while being held down? And the fact that John Kerry did absolutely nothing, and claimed to have been unaware of tasing, is shocking.
— Posted by Dylan
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55.
September 18th,
2007
1:26 pm
This isn’t about free speech, the 2004 election, Al-Qaeda, Bush, or Skull & Bones.
This is a case of bad behavior, bad manners, and bad attitudes.
The kid behaved inappropriately for a putatively “grown man”; I don’t know about you, but tussling with the cops is not considered smart behavior under any circumstances. Even practitioners of non-violent ideology specifically indicate that resisting arrest is not appropriate. If the kid wanted to make a political point, he could have done better. His questions were poorly articulated, and his tone was less than sincere. His physical resistance to being removed was a big, big mistake — and people should not misread that as being evidence of political suppression — that would be wrong.
The big loser, yet again, is John Kerry. I agree with others here that the man should have stepped up — and not in defense of free speech, but simply because it would have been good manners. Play the elder statesman by taking care of your people, not watching them from a stage. Silly. Just plain silly.
— Posted by Bill
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56.
September 18th,
2007
1:27 pm
This only furthers the evidence that John Kerry never deserved the Democratic nomination in the first place. This guy is a political hack and a loser. Doesn’t he have any recollection of the Viet Nam protests? He should have stood up for this kid and prevented this entire catastrophe. It is a travesty of justice that an American can be tasered just for asking a question. The police state is here. Real ID 2008 and RFID tagging of all citizens coming up…
— Posted by John Kerry
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57.
September 18th,
2007
1:28 pm
Yeah, I’m with #31. This is a stunt. The “tough questions” the kid was asking were downright stupid. “Were you and Bush in Skull and Bones?” Yes. The answer is yes. Everyone knows this. There is no “there” there.
Okay, the police over-reacted, and that should be dealt with. But to respond when a media-hungry kid behaves like a jerk as though this were another instance of the serious and troubling crowd-suppression being practiced by the Bush White House demeans real protests.
This guy was being a nuisance. The police, stupidly and too aggressively, let it get out of hand. They should be reprimanded and their performance otherwise reviewed. But tasering someone who’s behaving like an idiot is not a harbinger of the SS. Now if only they’d tasered John Kerry instead. There’s the guy who could use a little more electricity.
— Posted by Stuntman
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58.
September 18th,
2007
1:31 pm
Read post 14 yet again. I’s not taking like it should.
_____________
— Posted by ab irato
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59.
September 18th,
2007
1:31 pm
Shocking. Ok the student was resisting, but he’s a fucking unarmed student. I cannot believe the officers pinned him down and tased him…John Kerry lost my respect.
— Posted by Todd
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60.
September 18th,
2007
1:42 pm
Wow, It’s amazing that this could happen in broad daylight infront of umteen witnesses and on camera. Regardless of how one feels about the kid, the simple fact is that he has the right to ask those questions but rights seems to be something that is slowly fading in America.
The guy did offer to walk out and they still threw him down and tasered him. The reflection on John Kerry is not so great either as he should have been been more vocal about the situation but he seemed like a deer caught in headlights and didn’t know where to turn or what to say. I think the kid had a agenda and the police played right into his hand and he should sue them, How can we trust people like that to make quality decisions that might affect peoples life when a minor incident like this results in someone being tasered and arrested and now they are trying to make up charges? He asked several times “what am i being arrested for” and no one could tell him but now all these charges are coming out so the charges were made up after the fact. Shame on Kerry for no longer having and guts gut, but we saw that in the 2004 elections and shame on the university for having a really inept Police force that can’t find one brain in four officers.
— Posted by sherman
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61.
September 18th,
2007
1:45 pm
Like a thermometer registering a fever, this small incident is an indicator of a much larger sickness in our Republic. The reality is, we are NOT FREE. Of course, you are free to consume, rack up credit card debt, free to download all the porn and itunes and the cultural junk you can imbibe, free to holler and shout at sporting events, but heaven forbid, you get up in politico’s face, and speak truth, because you WILL be stepped on. I love America, I have served my country honorably, but I say this with complete clarity, we are beginning the long dark slide into Empire and imperial reign, Heaven help us.
Many say, “America, love it or leave it”, to which I say, “yes and amen”. I’m getting the message, the Great Experiment that Jefferson, Franklin and the Framers of the Consitution is swiftly coming to an end. Get ready for your “hitler”, my fellow Americans, he’s coming, pray it doesn’t happen in your lifetime.
— Posted by Neil
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62.
September 18th,
2007
1:46 pm
I just watched the copy of the video they have here. Everyone should check out the videos posted on CNN and on YouTube. There are much, much clearer videos available that show very well that the student was literally swarmed with officers when they tased him.
Also, the other videos show clearly that they practically had him out of the auditorium, but then they dragged him down in the aisle for some reason. They lifted him up again, then had him back down.
I still think the guy got exactly what he was trying to achieve, and I’m still wondering why the officers let him have his spectacle in a packed auditorium when it was entirely unnecessary.
— Posted by Kit
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63.
September 18th,
2007
1:47 pm
While I agree that resisting arrest is a serious crime, I think we need to consider the validity of the arrest here. Is being annoying for two or three minutes sufficient grounds for arrest? The man was asking questions in a forum open for questions.
Our politicians must be available for direct debate with the public. If we allow communication with politicians to become an orchestrated parade of softball questions to be answered by the same soundbites we saw on the news last night, we create remarkably low incentive toward participation in democracy.
— Posted by Amy
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64.
September 18th,
2007
1:48 pm
Todd, perhaps you can explain to the rest of us obviously naive, undereducated fooles what the difference is between “fucking unarmed student” and “unarmed student”. See what happens when you sleep through Freshman English 101?
— Posted by J. Goldberg
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65.
September 18th,
2007
1:48 pm
Ref: 11. This out-of-context video says nothing of the quality of a Florida education. There is no connection. “Conflict resolution is obviously not part of the official lexicon”? Silly.
— Posted by UF graduate Jay
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66.
September 18th,
2007
1:50 pm
Nonsense! The tasing was unnecessary and stupid, period. Furthermore, John Kerry wanted to answer teh question. Since when does using up your alloted time fo rquestions result in tasing… and don’t even go down the resisting arrest route, u obviously don’t know what resisting arrest is. What’s the next thing going to be after charging a kid with attempted murder with a deadly weapon, because he used a tennis shoe to beat up another kid. Nonsense all of it.
— Posted by Tony Dang
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67.
September 18th,
2007
1:57 pm
Agreed, the worst part about it is the way Kerry just drones on while it’s happening. Can we get some real leaders in the Democratic party, please?
— Posted by Dave
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68.
September 18th,
2007
1:59 pm
To use this as an example that free speech is doomed is ludicrous. Hello, there have been 32 posts on this issue thus far…I am unconcerned about the threat to free speech.
I am also not “shocked” that he was mistreated. It happens. It always will happen. It is an inherent weakness found in all those who are tasked with policing our society, eventually some of them will over-react. That is not a threat to freedom, but rather a fact of life. The real issue is what happens afterwards. There will be an investigation, and if it is determined that they did not act reasonably, they will be appropriately punished. Oh my Goodness! The system works!
On a personal note, given how much effort this kid CLEARLY went through to set the whole thing up, don’t you think he would be a little disappointed if he hadn’t been tasered? If he had been quickly, quietly, and appropriately subdued and removed, no one would be talking about him. How depressing would that have been. He needs to send the police a thank you card for giving him EXACTLY what he WANTED.
— Posted by Nojkodeus
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69.
September 18th,
2007
2:04 pm
Where was the even host/moderator/organizer? Last time I checked it was not the responsibility of police, campus or otherwise, to tell someone when to stop talking. If in fact this guy was told to stop at some point (that isn’t in the video) and refused, then there is a reason for campus police to be involved IF (and it’s a big if) there was an apparent threat to the safety of others. Based on the video I’d say that no threat existed, he was just being rude. And if rudeness gets you arrested than we need to build new jails.
— Posted by Molly
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70.
September 18th,
2007
2:10 pm
The following is the email I just sent to Senator Kerry:
Senator,
As a born and bred Boston, Kennedy Dem your age, someone who began picketing Woolworth’s on Park Street at the age of 13, someone who marched and fought against the Vietnam War and the current war, someone whose French is as good as yours, and someone who still, even in the current climate of fear and loathing, believes in the basic goodness of America,
I am appaled by your performance. Shocked at your apathy. Disgusted by your disregard for the most common of human feelings.
To quote another Boston hero, “Have you no decency, Sir, at long last?”
You were a hero of mine Senator, when you returned from Vietnam. What has happened to the righteous, truly patriotic indignation that you expressed so eloquently as a young man?
— Posted by Jim fine
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71.
September 18th,
2007
2:10 pm
I cannot contain my glee at seeing this annoying a-hole getting tased.
— Posted by chesterdog
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72.
September 18th,
2007
2:12 pm
“When it comes to diatribes aimed at politicians during question-and-answer sessions, Andrew Meyer was utterly unexceptional during John Kerry’s appearance at the University of Florida. And the heavy-handed police escort was nothing that the ladies of Code Pink wouldn’t recognize from their numerous exits from the Petraeus-Crocker hearings last week.”
What a lousy way to open a crucial dialog on freedom of speech in “post-9/11″ USA. Another smarmy NYT writer yawning while Rome is burning…
I was arrested in NYC on February 15, 2003, along with hundreds of others for protesting too loudly the imminent invasion of Iraq. The most striking thing was that the police officers responded to our righteous indignation by asserting that they “are not operating under the constitution” anymore, rather “under Homeland Security.” (!)
So good for this Mr. Meyer for using his brain and voice and confronting that limp wrist, John Kerry, who showed again just how weak and irrelevant he is. It’s embarrassing how many Kerry/Edwards stickers still emblazon bumpers here in Seattle.
The worst part of watching this video by far was those fool students who began applauding as Mr. Meyer was being dragged out by jack-boot campus cops. I had a similar experience at NJIT when I circulated fliers questioning the low minority student ration in the architecture college (NJSOA). A certain Professor Karen Franck led a classroom full of students in a repudiation against my minor protest. The feeling of betrayal by fellow students and peers is hard to describe, but it came flooding back watching this video. You have to wonder what hope there is if college students don’t even know that it’s their responsibility to use their privilege and opportunity to question backwards authority, fight injustice and be subversive! Otherwise, we end up with institutions full of Mike Nizzas.
— Posted by Matthew Smith
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73.
September 18th,
2007
2:13 pm
Viewing the videos of the uniformed officers takedown of Andrew Meyer and their apparent use of a taser to silence his interesting questions, I am reminded of a quote from George Washington:
“If the freedom of speech is taken away then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter.”
I also recall that torture is a federal felony under Title 18, Part I, Chapter 113C, punishable by up to 20 years imprisonment.
HENRY EDWARD HARDY
Ann Arbor, MI
scanlyze.wordpress.com
— Posted by Henry Edward Hardy
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74.
September 18th,
2007
2:14 pm
So what if Andrew Meyer is a loudmouth, a boor, etc.? The First Amendment covers him, too. His questons (or rant) to Kerry were only a minute or two long and were garden variety political speech. Why did the police grab him in the first place? And what does Kerry have to say about this shameful incident?
— Posted by John Plotz
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75.
September 18th,
2007
2:18 pm
In watching the clip, it never crossed my mind that this young man was annoying or otherwise being a boor.
In the least he appeared to be enthused by the act of asking questions.
And questions which I’ve not heard asked in the media.
He also didn’t take much time at all.
This shows what a passive dolt Kerry is. He should have taken charge of the moment to restrain the cops.
This is completely in keeping with the reputation he developed during the campaign.
— Posted by js
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76.
September 18th,
2007
2:19 pm
My local Fox News station in Manhattan spun the story to try and make Kerry look bad. They said Kerry “claimed” he was willing to answer the question, but it “wasn’t clear what he was doing” while the melee went on, which — if you read the AP story — is a lie. According to the AP, Kerry can be heard more than once telling the cops (who probably were too busy to hear him) that it was okay, he would answer the question. Fox wants you to imagine him grinning with folded arms as a guy gets tasered.
As for Meyer himself, he apparently asked several questions and got answers. Anybody who has ever been to one of these open-mike things knows there’s always some jerk who wants to monopolize them, and can’t let go of his moment in the sun. Meyer apparently was told to stop, his mike shut off, and when they had to remove him physically, struggled. Maybe the cops were at fault too, but he definitely helped escalate it. He wanted to stay and ask more questions. All night, I shouldn’t wonder.
— Posted by ducdebrabant
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77.
September 18th,
2007
2:25 pm
Let’s not confuse Andrew Meyer with Aung San Suu Kyi. He abused his freedom of speech by not giving up the microphone and not allowing other people to ask questions. What happened to these people’s freedom of speech? I regret that the UF police used a Taser against him (it did not seem that necessary), but there was evidence of provocation in the video (i.e., resisting police officers). Andrew Meyer is not a sympathetic victim and not a poster child for freedom of expression.
— Posted by Michel
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78.
September 18th,
2007
2:26 pm
I don’t buy the defense of the officers as protecting themselves. The student is clearly “out-gunned.” I would think that all officers would be trained to handle such a simple situation without the use of a potentially deadly weapon. It seems like these inexperienced officers took the situation personally as opposed to being leveled-headed and escorting the guy out. And why did he need to be removed anyway?
— Posted by Nick
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79.
September 18th,
2007
2:30 pm
The people who support the police on this should try getting shocked by a taser sometime and then decide if he deserved that. I can’t really see why they decided to remove him in the first place, considering the nature of the event. Was it because he was too long-winded in his question? Too passionate in the way he asked? Giving blind authority to the police is a dangerous thing and has the potential of infringing on our most fundamental freedoms.
Andrew may be able to sue the university in this case, and he’s actually very lucky that it was university police that did this. If it was a city cop, no lawyer would touch his case without full compensation because you can’t win any money by suing the police. And who can afford a lawyer just to seek justice?
— Posted by Jessica
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80.
September 18th,
2007
2:33 pm
To me, this guys comments and point were useless–and he was ranting, yes, so he should have been removed. The use of a taser however, was completely unjustified.
These cops did themselves, and police everywhere, a huge disservice through their actions. Six cops should have easily been able to remove one struggling, but unarmed student. If they can’t do that without the use of a potentially dangerous (and in some cases, deadly) weapon, then THEY SHOULD NOT BE COPS ANY LONGER.
— Posted by tyler
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81.
September 18th,
2007
2:35 pm
Wow, Mr. Meyers was charged with a felony, and all he did was ask why were the cops dragging him and why he was being arrested and all he had was a book.
Meanwhile four cops manhandle him, drag him to the back of an auditorium, and then shock him with a stun gun: and they aren’t charged; all of this happens in the same room with a United States Senator. I guess this all makes sense when you remember it’s Florida.
— Posted by Kim Patrick Clow
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82.
September 18th,
2007
2:41 pm
I am convinced that Andrew Myer was not actually tasered.
A person being tasered is typically incapacitated, even if only briefly. If he had been tasered, I don’t believe Mr Meyers would have had sufficient control over his own body to be able to continuously shout “Ow! Ow! Ow!” I think he merely wanted everyone to believe he’d been tasered, and to create a scene.
While I am absolutely for free speech and abhor violent suppression of this basic civil right, I think Mr Meyers abused his right, and that the police were justified in removing him from the arena. However, violence, including tasering, was definitely not called for in this situation.
— Posted by J Donald
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83.
September 18th,
2007
2:41 pm
Completely fake, this kid. This little punk was begging for this reaction from the Police, begging for it! And he got what he wanted. And all the simps around him hollering, “Rodney King, Rodney King!”. Jesus can’t come back soon enough. Is this what we’ve become? Is this all that we are?
— Posted by Carl La Fong
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84.
September 18th,
2007
2:58 pm
I don’t think I can tell from the video whether or not he was actually resisting at the point where he claimed to be tasered. Neither can I tell whether he was actually tasered or just yelling “ow” a lot. Maybe it was real, but it didn’t sound very convincing to me. I’ve heard better fake screams. Even if it was real, he clearly kept up the yelling purely for dramatic purposes.
It did seem like the police stopped him unnecessarily early but without knowing what happened prior, I don’t feel confident passing judgement on that.
I did hear Kerry saying that he would answer the question and it sounded like he was trying to resolve the conflict. Considering how obstructed the camera view was, I doubt he could see clearly what was going on. It’s also clear that he did not ask the officers to stop the questioner.
The audience even seemed like they were cheering when the questioner was hauled away — it wasn’t till the cries about the taser that the audience’s tone shifted.
In short… based on this video alone… I am not especially alarmed. It’s possible that with more information I would be, but I doubt it. Kerry seemed to conduct himself very reasonably, he was very patient, and nothing I heard or saw made it look like he did anything to start or escalate this.
I do agree with some of what the questioner was trying to say. I think he could have made his points in a more appropriate fashion, however.
— Posted by JD
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85.
September 18th,
2007
3:04 pm
Was Mayer violating any stated rules about asking questions, including any rule about taking a specified time to do so before sitting down? Was there any reason to think he represented a physical threat to anyone? Did someone in authority order the security types to act…and if so, who was that and what was the reason? On the other hand, IF Mayer had been asking a prolonged pro-Bush, pro-war, conservative question, does anyone tend to think the police would have acted as they did, including the tasing? There’s a strong suggestion here that the content of the question, not the conduct, was a major element in the police conduct. One big loser here was “University” of Florida, a producer of football games that was hardly famous for its intellectual excellence to begin with!
— Posted by JO
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86.
September 18th,
2007
3:08 pm
I’ve seen worse hecklers at a bad comedy show. This man did not deserve to be removed from the microphone. Just because the police tell someone to do something does not mean that Americans have to obey, but the police mentality is that the person is now “resisting” and anything goes. That is plain wrong. Americans MUST stand up and ask long hard questions of politicians or we all become sheep under the guns of power.
What really bothers me is that an ex-Presidential candidate that I voted for did not step in and stop this. He was the only person in the room that would not have been tasered himself if he tried to stop the excessive police behavior, yet he did nothing except the pathetic “I’ll answer his question.”. Meyer was not violent or agressive before being grabbed by the police to be ejected - he had excellent questions in fact. TAKING TOO LONG TO ASK A QUESTION is not a crime and should never lead to arrest.
— Posted by C. Reaves
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87.
September 18th,
2007
3:25 pm
Is this a sign of the ominous police state mentality run amok, or is it an indication of the sort of people who seek jobs as cops? Or both?
It could also be part of a broad conspiracy linked to Yale.
ON the one hand, you can’t claim what happened to the kid is anything new. This is happening everyday. The difference here is just the video was rolling and You Tube is an upload away.
Go online and find the tape posted in the past few days of the cop who pulled over the kid who happened to have a camera rigged up in his front seat. That’s a beauty and offeres a good psychological profile of some types of people who gravitate to positions of authority over others.
Of course, I also remember Kent State. We’re right back to that all over again, I fear.
So much to glean here….If you want to get more from this video than just the hard to believe action, go back and watch it carefully three or four times. When the kid was yelling for “help!!!!!”, check out the reaction (or, lack thereof) of the audience members who are within the picture on the video. Talk about fear and failure to question authority.
Nobody even screamed at the cops - “what the hell are you doing!?!” or “leave him alone, you idiots!” or, what would have been best of all “you’re being videotaped! You’re going to wind up on You Tube! - and you are going to each be personally sued for your actions!!!!”
As far as getting the goons off the big-mouthed kid (especially as he offered to leave), that last comment probably would have worked immediately!
By the way, it was the kid’s right to be there and to ask obnoxious questions. Being obnoxious is not illegal. Like the kid begged to have answered - what did he do? It also so happened that his questions were pretty good.
This leads to the Yale conspiracy angle. The cops are part of the global squad top protect a secret society bent on global domination!
Doesn’t it bug anyone that people who belonged to a student cult at Yale have wound up in the positions they have? Think about it.
No wonder the kid got the stun gun….he’s lucky they didn’t kill him.
— Posted by John Harrington
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88.
September 18th,
2007
3:27 pm
It’s obvious that he wanted and incident and was given a chance to say his peace, but selfishly insisted on taking more time than others who wanted to speak. When asked to leave he chose to throw a tantrum than remain calm and rational. Instead of a taser the police should have borrowed a pledge paddle from a school fraternity and give a spoiled brat what he deserved a swat and and time out.
— Posted by Jeff
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89.
September 18th,
2007
3:37 pm
There are so many people here who seem to think that we have to obey the police no matter what, that even if the order is wrong you must obey and then go to court. That is oh so wrong. What would have happened if the black kids in Greensboro had simply obeyed the police order to leave the Woolworth’s lunch counter in the 1960s? As Americans we have the OBLIGATION not to obey an unlawful order by the police.
What is very scary is that even by the policing standards of the 60’s the behavior shown by the UF police when they simply decided that the questioner should no longer be there was over the line.
— Posted by C. Reaves
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90.
September 18th,
2007
3:45 pm
UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA TASER INCIDENT SHOULD HAVE BEEN AVOIDED, SAYS ACLU
Review of University Police Policies, Investigation Needed
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:
September 18, 2007
CONTACT:
Brandon Hensler, Director of Communications, (786) 363-2700 or media@aclufl.org
GAINESVILLE, Fla. – The American Civil Liberties Union of Florida today expressed dismay at the circumstances surrounding a University of Florida Police Officer’s use of a taser gun in the process of arresting a student at a speech by U.S. Senator John Kerry in Gainesville. The student, Andrew Meyer, was forcibly removed by campus police from a microphone where he was asking questions of Sen. Kerry.
Kerry can be heard expressing a desire to respond to Meyer’s questions in videotape coverage of the campus incident, so the question becomes – did police squander the free speech rights of both Kerry and Meyer?
“Apart from the taser use issues, one must consider the free speech implications of the police officers’ actions,” said Howard Simon, ACLU of Florida Executive Director. “People have a reasonable expectation to ask questions in a public setting – even if they are aggressive and some disagree with their position – that is free speech plain and simple. Similarly – Kerry had a reasonable expectation to be able to answer those questions. Neither of them was able to exercise their free speech rights due to the police action.”
Additionally, it appears that sufficient police force was present to control Meyer without the need to taser him. If that is the case, which only a comprehensive investigation can determine, this may be a classic example of excessive force. A review of the police department’s policies and protocols on use of tasers, as well as the officer’s actions, will be required to determine whether use of the taser was warranted or if indeed, poor judgment was exercised.
“The answers to these, and other questions, will only be known once the police conduct an investigation into the officer’s actions,” said Glenn Katon, ACLU of Florida Central Region Office Director. “The use of tasers has grown exponentially in recent years, and the jury is still out, so to speak, on what best practices are for how and when to use them. This case appears disturbing and certainly merits a full investigation.”
The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) of Florida is freedom’s watchdog, working daily in the courts, legislatures and communities to defend individual rights and personal freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. For additional information, visit our Web site at: www.aclufl.org.
# # #
— Posted by Alexandra Bassil
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91.
September 18th,
2007
3:46 pm
I think the kid was simply exercising his constitutional rights. He was using his right to free speech and he shouldn’t be arrested and definitely not tasered for that. I think that all questions and conspiracys should be brought up about these events because the public has a right to know about who they are electing to control the country for the next 4-8 years and all their belifs. I know many of these things to be tru because I have cousins in Florida that told me personally that they couldn’t vote because they were listed as criminals when they didn’t do any such crime ever in their life. Just recently Diebold voting machines that had been tested for security were all hacked into on every attempt and were still permitted to be used in the upcoming elections. This kid did nothing wrong and we the people have every right to have these events investigated.
— Posted by Evan
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92.
September 18th,
2007
3:49 pm
“Oh, please. It’s called resisting arrest.”
So they are arresting him for “resisting arrest?”
That doesn’t quite make sense to me.
— Posted by yando
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93.
September 18th,
2007
4:35 pm
Now does anyone remember what John Kerry said last night??? GOOD
— Posted by Kevin Griggs
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94.
September 18th,
2007
4:42 pm
How very rude and disruptive of Meyers asking questions “the pros” should have been asked three years ago. It’s not surprising he’s a bit breathless in his questioning, since it may well have been his first opportunity to be around let alone question one of the more famous political “leaders” in the US.
Where the Times pros as pointed in it’s description of say the Bush Administrations “diatrabes” maybe the American People might know more than they do.
Trying to foist off the wonders of freedom in the US because this episode was coverd on Youtube beggars belief. This appeared NOWHERE in the mass media (you’ve all been fetishing over OJ) until it lit up the internet. It’s obvious that after not questionig politicians properly you’ve not taken to questioning your own relevance or competence.
As for the police, repulsive conduct but then they have rights don’t they.
— Posted by Disgusted with the "Paper of Record"
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95.
September 18th,
2007
4:53 pm
Tase him again, this is not about free speech.
— Posted by Rich Chicago, IL
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96.
September 18th,
2007
5:05 pm
There’s no constitutional right to disrupt someone else’s event. And if the police try to escort you out, it’s not smart to wrestle with them. He got what he deserved.
— Posted by E. O'Neal
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97.
September 18th,
2007
5:26 pm
It seems to me that this young man may indeed have been manic, and not merely just obnoxious. Anybody think of that? He exhibits classic symptoms of a person escalating into grandiosity, lability and compromised behavior. Of course, the police response was outrageously over the top. And, Kerry drones on… just like during the “debates”.
— Posted by Rev. Rick
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98.
September 18th,
2007
6:18 pm
Just saw on Fox News that this guy’s hobby is causing disruptive scenes, such as in restaurants and during the ending of Harry Potter movies. The press has been had.
— Posted by E. O'Neal
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99.
September 18th,
2007
6:38 pm
Lighten up everyone. Johnny Knoxville got tased voluntarily on Jackass. No big deal.
— Posted by The voice of reason
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100.
September 18th,
2007
6:50 pm
Too many disconnented items here. Questions and actions all taken out of context. I hope at some point the whole episode will come forth. The young man was quite obviously looking for his fifteen minutes of fame while asking questions anyone who has paid attention would already know the answers to. He obviously didn’t go through civil protest 101.
Rule 1: Do not resist. Go limp and force them to carry you out. Continue your statement and cut the victim theatrics.
Did they tas him?? I don’t think so. Having been tased, the first thing on your mind is are you alive and can you still breathe.
Performance art carries a set of risks and I think this was a performance.
The fact remains that during the Bush administration it has been quite clear that no dissent, objection, heckling or comment will be allowed while the masters are speaking. This is not a comment on Mr Kerry, but rather a comment on where our american society has gone in the age of fear mongering, executive power and the crushing (think Nixon’s enemy lists) of dissent. The mantra has come to ” be afraid, be very afraid”. I don’t fear the terrorists, as they have a very small chance of effecting me personally. I fear the cynical, elitist, neocon empire builders who will sell us and our civil rights down the river for the personnal gains they will achieve by leading the dumbed down, self centered american populace to the world of eternal conflict that Orwell warned us of. The police state is upon us and many of the people with the guns and the tasers are to shallow and untrained to even understand what freedom is are instead trained to maintain order above all else and let someone else down the line sort it out.
This was a sad day for america.
— Posted by byron
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101.
September 18th,
2007
7:04 pm
The police should be held fully accountable for this. He was annoying so what that does not mean it is okay to taze him. Some people say he was disruptive, well get over it you don’t see teachers tazing kids across the nation. If he was disruptive so what, he did not move to hurt someone, the police just decided they didn’t like this kid and wanted to taze him so they did and then blame it all on him. Oh and I think he’s trying to get away from you all becuase there are six big cops with tasers coming at you threatining to taze you for no reason. Now I don’t know how dumb some of you are but I would run from the excruciatingly painful taser that can cause side effects like DEATH YES DEATH TASERS CAN KILL YOU THE POLICE HAVE KILLED A LOT OF PEOPLE BY TRYING TO CALM THEM DOWN WITH A TASER, I DONT KNOW ABOUT YOU I WOULD NOT BE CALM AFTER BEING TAZED IF I WAS STILL ALIVE. These are just trigger happy cops abusing their power and trying to blame it on their victim who could be traumatized!
— Posted by jj
by Brian Young on September 19th, 2007
I’m the Online Communications Director for John Kerry, and I wanted to post this to the JK blog to update you with more info about what happened at the University of Florida event.
Senator Kerry has been very busy with Senate business yesterday and today – as you may have heard, there’ve been critical votes being taken on major issues such as the Republican filibuster against restoring habeas corpus, et cetera – but needless to say, he’s been in close touch with me and his other staffers about the Florida controversy as well.
There’s been a lot of misinformation and confusion about what happened there on Monday, so I wanted to be sure to share what I know about it with you here on the Senator’s blog.
First of all, it was a really bad situation all the way around. No one wants to see someone get tasered. Sure, the kid was obnoxious and physically resisting, and to a certain extent, when you physically resist cops you do put yourself in a risky situation. (Ever see photos of Kerry getting arrested in ’71 for civil disobedience? He and his fellow Vietnam Vets calmly marched off to jail without raising a ruckus…)
Still, personally speaking, I wish this ended in a number of ways that didn’t involve jolts of electricity. But, I’m not here to give my own opinions. You can read any of the many threads about this incident on the various political blogs for lots of those. (Links to a sampling of various discussions of it are posted below, and as you can see for yourselves, I’m definitely not cherry-picking them for happy talk and nice-to-hear comments…) I’m just going to give you a quick description of what the scene looked like from the stage, and let you know what JK told me directly about the situation.
Now, to the narrative as I got it from JK and a couple others who were there … First, here’s the preamble to this YouTube video that so many of you have seen by now (and by the way, what I’m about to tell you happened closely tracks to this diary on Daily Kos and to this eyewitness account that was posted on a right-wing, not lefty, blog as well):
There was a long line of people waiting to ask questions, and Meyer was near the back. He rushed up to the mic, butting up past many, many kids and making a scene. Apparently he’d been talking with the police and they were arguing long before Meyer ever got to the mic (reports from Florida are that they had threatened him with arrest already).
That’s why there are police in the video when you first see it. They tried to remove him before he said anything, but JK intervened, calling them off and saying he’d answer his question. Remember, back in 2004, there was a lot of press about how open the Kerry campaign was to outside questioners and even protesters, especially compared with the hermetically sealed Bush campaign. JK’s done thousands of these events, really enjoys them (he told me once that doing Q&As with regular citizens is the best part of his job), and he’s totally comfortable dealing with disruptive people. So he made sure to call the U of F police off. Which, technically, he had no authority to do, since this was a U of F event, not a Kerry event. They were their police.
Anyway, then Meyer started to ask his question — questions, actually, which turned into a rant before he was interrupted by the cops — and you’ve all probably seen and heard most of it in the videos by now.
Part way through, JK asked him for an actual question because there were still others waiting and time was running short. (Kerry’d been taking questions for a solid 45 minutes.) These kinds of events put on by universities are difficult because Senator Kerry wants to get as many questions in as possible, and there are always A LOT of people waiting. So, the kid kept going, JK was listening respectfully, and then the mic was cut off (either because whoever was in charge of the mic thought he was just ranting about whatever came to mind or because the U of F folks didn’t like the profanity he was using … I have no idea), and the police tried to move him away from the mic.
At this point, Kerry kept trying to answer Meyer’s questions and restore calm. He told me that at this point he wanted to make sure to maintain calm in the room as much as possible (these kinds of events can get out of control in a crowd, and he didn’t want that), and he told the police he was happy to answer the question. As he said in the statement and as he told me, he thinks he could’ve handled the whole thing without interruption. Unfortunately, things went downhill from there.
Meyer was pulled into the back of the room and the real scuffling began. From the stage, JK couldn’t see what was going on at all (it was a huge room, the stage lights were very bright and the back of the hall was pretty dark). So he tried to move things forward, giving the question of voting rights the respect it deserves and trying to answer his question. He had no idea at the time what kind of scuffle was going on, and who was doing what to whom. He honestly had no idea that the kid was tasered until later.
From there, after the scuffle moved out of the room, John Kerry made sure to answer some more questions — including the main question the kid had been asking — and then he stayed around for quite some time after the event to shake hands, answer questions one-on-one, sign autographs if people wanted them …
The whole thing just basically … it was just a bad, bad situation, and as JK said in his statement, he’s never had anything end like that before. Maybe Meyer was rude to his fellow students, obnoxious, and physically resisting police, but you never, ever want to see anyone get tasered.
Anyway, I wanted to give you the rundown beyond just the original official statement here on the blog. There’ve been a lot of other videos posted around the web by now, including some from the MSM sites that give a much fuller picture of what actually happened at that event than the initial, edited-for-maximum-effect YouTube videos were, and we’ve included links to some of those below as well. There’s also links to some other local and national news reports that give a lot more detail about the events leading up to the incident than was originally available when the story first spread around the web like wildfire.
By the way – not to anyone’s surprise, we’ve been getting slammed by hundreds and hundreds of comments about this situation here on the blog, and it totally overwhelmed our ability to process them for publication in a timely way. We’ll be posting a lot of them as the day goes on, though we’ll be weeding out the redundant ones and those that were just too rude or crude to be pubbed. But rest assured, they haven’t been ignored, each and every one of them has been saved, and we’ll definitely make sure that they’re all read by all the right people, not just swept under the rug.
Daily Kos threads:
- Student tasered at Kerry event — Video — Updated
- In Gainesville Today (Taser story- many updates)
- One Lawyer’s Take on the Kerry Tazing Incident
- Eyewitness Account of the Student Tazering
- What Happened From John Kerry’s Perspective
- A constructive suggestion to John Kerry
Democratic Underground threads:
- Explain this now, John Kerry
- A witness to the Kerry event where a tesor was used has an interesting take on the event
- Woman who shot the Meyer taser video said Kerry tried to stop the police
- “Meyer did ask, at one point, if the cameras were going to be at the jail.”
Huffington Post threads:
- Today’s Homework: More Talk, Less Taser
- Student Asks Kerry Tough Question, Kerry Watches Him Get Tasered
- A Shocking Moment for Society: Tasering at University of Florida
Big Dogs Weblog:
- Update on Tazed Florida Student – The Interview
MichelleMalkin.com:
- Student tasered at John Kerry forum Update: A University of Florida student/eyewitness shares what he saw
Neocon News blog:
- Tasered Mess: A complete dissection (so far)
KerryVision.net:
- Losing Perspective for the Sake of Outrage
- Count Every Vote
The Democratic Daily:
- Attention Seeker Gets 15 Minutes of Fame… Police Report Shows Meyer’s Behavior Differed On and Off Camera
Democracy for new Hampshire:
- U of Florida Student tasered when trying to ask Kerry about neglected counting of every vote
The Carpetbagger Report:
- Student gets tasered at Kerry event in Florida
The Gainesville Sun:
- Taser incident sparks more protest
- Police: Meyer calmer off camera
- Friend: Media coverage disappoints Meyer
The Alligator (UF-based independent newspaper):
- Sen. John Kerry speaks about Iraq at UF
- UF student Tasered at Kerry forum
The Baltimore Sun:
- Witness defends Kerry response to Taser incident
The Herald-Tribune:
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2007/09/19/student_at_a_kerry_event_is_tasered”>- Student at a Kerry event is Tasered, Senator’s speech in Fla. becomes YouTube fodder
The Chicago Tribune:
- Student Arrested, Tasered at Kerry Event
The New York Times:
- Taking Sides in a Tasing
CBS News:
- Tasering Sparks Free Speech Debate, College Student’s Motives Also Questioned After Arrest During John Kerry Forum
ABC News / Political Radar:
- Kerry Condemns Heckler Arrest
Associated Press:
- Student Arrested, Tasered at Kerry Event
—-—-—-—-—-—-—-
68 Responses to “Update and Info on the UF Incident”
1. victorb Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 03:30 PM
Why would John Kerry find the need to vote this week, when his attendance for senate votes in the past is close to zero? Is that so he doesn't have to face questions about what really happened at University of Florida. This is a freedom of speech country and if he didn't want to answer the question, he didn't have to. What a joke
2. Michael Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 03:33 PM
As a student and a political science major I am completely overwhelmed by the actions that took place in Florida. To think that this course of events could happen to me if I attended a university debate with a public official is quite honest emotionally traumatic. As a political junkie I have always liked Senator Kerry's politics and I think he possess great leadership quality. However I truly believe that he should address this issue publicly as soon as possible. Making an excuse is not going to cut it. If Senator Kerry wants to become a national icon for freedom and people's rights then he should stand up publicly against the actions in Florida. Additionally he should publicly answer the question posed because now everyone has seen the question on youtube but no one except the actually witnesses saw his answer. Throwing in an apology to the student probably wouldn't hurt his rating either. I know if I saw "JK" address this swiftly and compassionately it would convince me that he has the leadership ability to be President.
3. Sarah Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 03:47 PM
It's not acceptable to arrest someone let alone taser them for asking questions, even if they were being asked in perhaps an obnoxious manner. The actions of the police were shocking but the lack of reaction from John Kerry was just as disturbing. How could John Kerry just stand by and pretend nothing was happening? It's disgusting to see crowds of people doing nothing when someone is being brutally attacked for speaking their mind! This is something I might imagine happening in some other country, not in here in America.
4. Karen Morin Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 04:11 PM
It seems this blog is now just changing the facts..the video shows the student being tasered and begging for help numerous times. It didn't happen in the back of the room it happened right in from of"JK"...Brian on the online communicator is now implying all kinds of things about the student resisting..he didn't. There were 6 cops some smiling as they ASSAULTED him, first you say JK left and then you say he stayed and answered questions afterwards. He knews to speak out that this is wrong we don't live in a dictatorship we have the right to expect to speak freely without being attacked. Do the right thing JK say it was wrong
5. Mary Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 04:20 PM
I find this a totally unacceptable response to the situation. First off, there was no physical resistance. The young man did not touch the cops, in fact, he had his hands up before they wrestled him out of the room and down to the ground and jolted him with potentially lethal force. Regardless of the misnomer of "non-lethal", tasers have killed people. The Senator need to apologize to this student and to the American people for failing to uphold his oath to support and defend the constitution.
6. Jason Simpson Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 05:05 PM
Very likely Sen. Kerry could have managed to handle the situation had the police not interfered. All the rest is really beside the point. Senator Kerry may not have the "authority" to call of the police, but he should have intervened actively in what was obviously a case of police brutality. And no, the student should not have been removed from the outset, as you seem to suggest. In this country we are supposed to have the right of free speech. And in all realism, it is not always possible to have the atmosphere of a polite tea party. As has become usual in American discourse, there is no awareness of principles. It was not enough for the Senator to calmly ask that the student be allowed to finish. When it was clear that police were removing the person, let alone tasering him, he should have intervened actively, and above all once it was clear that he was being brutalized. I might add that the students themselves were shamefully passive before this act. Cowardice and violence, hypocrisy and prevarication, seem to be the order of the day in our rapidly degenerating country, of which the politicians are the prime example.
7. Alessandro Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 05:17 PM
thank you for the answer. But the essential of democraty is not the police is the "Question"!!! Please take off the student from the jail. Kerry do the garanty you know the fight... A friend of Italy
8. GV Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 05:20 PM
Sarah, Karen and Mary- Were you at this event? The reaction I've seen from students who were at the event tell a completely different story. Eyewitness testimony:"However, while Senator Kerry was responding to a student's question, all of a sudden Meyer rushed to the microphone with cops in pursuit. At that point no one knew what was going on. Could he have a gun, a bomb?" - UF student Tyler Antar http://tinyurl.com/yudw3f "John kerry did try to interfere with the police. at one point, police where holding on to meyers. kerry got to a point where he almost lost his composure and said officer guy. you, let him go. i do want to hear his question, i do want to hear to what he has to say. i do want to answer him. that was at the point the officers said will pull you aside to ask your question. but as he was attempting to ask his question. the officers themselves appeared to me to make themselves clear not allowing him to stay and hear the question and yelling into his ear." http://tinyurl.com/2ygxbx So, this guy disrupts an event where hundreds of people were gathered to listen and speak to John Kerry. The Mr. Meyers is there for one reason only, and that that was to disrupt the event and heckle a United States Senator. And some of you are sticking up for Meyers? Incredible. Here's The Mr. Meyers: Now, you have to know this about me: I am huge Marlins fan, and a born heckler. My purpose in life is to badger, jeer, and cajole professional athletes. I have angered two other All-Star baseball players, Bobby Abreu and Odalis Perez, on separate occasions. I have booed singers that mess up the national anthem. Heck, I’ll even heckle other hecklers if I don’t care for their stuff. What happened during this particular game was destined to be, the paths of Griffey and I on a collision course. http://www.freewebs.com/newforum/bioandpersonalstories.htm Sen. Kerry handled this exactly as he should have. I wish the cops hadn't tased the guy, but that was their choice, and they'll have to deal with the consequences. This incident is not about Sen. Kerry, it's about the cops and how they handled some disturbed college kid. Sheesh.
9. Bruce Shaffstall Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 05:21 PM
I am a 58 year old business owner, father and grandfather of 4. Old guy so to speak. An ex-Marine, A viet nam vet, like John. A converted republican who supported John in 2004. I find Brian's response protecting Senator Kerry, a bold faced lie, typical of the current republican administration way of handling things. Senator, your non action when this situation occured is out-right inexcuseable. So you are a Senator? Do you believe in free speach? Do you believe that you need to set an example on up-holding peoples' rights in this country? I cannot believe that I actually supported someone like you. You have no excuse. And your lack of even an apology show me what kind of man you really are. So the lights were too bright, and you couldn't see what was going on? Were your ears plugged up?. And why NOT answer the question? Too sensitive? Can't handle the pressure? You wanted to be President? You actually approved of the response written by your team? You are not even a good citizen. A good Citizen would have helped the Student, and tried to get the Police to back off. You actually approve of the way Police are handling situations now days? I am actually glad that you lost even thought I don't thisnk you really did? How much did the Military Industrial Complex pay you to step down? You ARE no different than Bush. Nazi Germany wasn't as bad. they hadn't invented tazers yet. Ha ha Bye John, you have lost a lot over this one. You do not have the respect you once held. Bruce
10. Pauline Guillermo Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 05:31 PM
I find this statement ridiculous and unacceptable considering what happened at the UF town hall meeting. I can only believe my eyes and ears as I view the video. Shame on the attendees that clapped while the police officers converged on this young man exercising his free speech rights and duties. Shame on Senator Kerry for being as oblivious at President Bush in that Florida classroom on 9/11. Senator Kerry should have spoken up and protected this young man's rights to the microphone. There was no reason for the police action I saw unless we are living in a fascist state. Senator Kerry must apologize to the Mr. Meyer and the American people.
11. Marjorie G Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 05:37 PM
I am as appalled at what may have been an excessive use of force. Do your above views change when you find that the aggrieved wanted, participated and planned this outcome? I hope all will read the information contained in the articles linked. The Senator wanted to maintain the calm, for a situation we are only now learning about completely. Beyond verbally asking the police to stop, at an event and security not his own, was he to bolt off the stage as a caped crudsader? The video was only part of the room's perspective and unfolding of the events. I caution readers and posters following, that sometimes people opine for insincere reasons, feigned outrage, or with an agenda. That's politics, and a life that's public in service of strong convictions. Taking Kerry to task for a police force issue out of his control, and for an election subject he does answer - just not in the way to heal the hurt or in the same way some want to hear it, does harm to a man of integrity championing our causes, as well to the causes needing a champion.
12. Lawrence Minadeo Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 06:01 PM
I voted for John Kerry in the last election, and now I am truly thankful he did not become president. His inability to protect the First amendment rights of a petulant andrew meyer, his utter incompetance in not stopping the actions by the zealous police disgusts me. I will never again vote for John Kerry and will be sure to vociferously work against any re-election plans in the future. Bad move Senator, I find you to be a wimp, and totally without character. Sincerely, Lawrence Minadeo
13. Anna Wood Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 06:02 PM
I still can't believe it and if you start now to look for excuses why the police acted in a reasonable way, then you obviously do not realize how this incident is going to backfire on John Kerry. There is more than one video on you tube and they all show an agitated student led away by a groupe of policemen who handcuffed him and tazered him. All in the presence of John Kerry. Didn't JK hear the student's cries? Why did JK react in this lame fashion? This didn't happen on the airport or any such sensitive area. This was not a terrorist, but a student !!! As a European I am shocked. Is this the great US? Is this your freedom of speech? Being tazered seems to be an overreaction and I do not want to imagine what is going to be next. Incredible. Maybe it's time to take a good look at yourself and ask yourself, what happened to democracy.
14. Lee Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 06:14 PM
This was an American function at an American University with American students conversing with an American Senator. "America The Free" - just not in speech, or at least when the Senator is asked a tough question or two. John Kerry may not have had the "legal authority" to stop the radical police officers, but I bet you money, if Senator John Kerry, had come off that stage in defense of the American young man being wrestled to the ground and having jolts of electricity blown through his body - He COULD HAVE STOPPED THIS FROM HAPPENING! However, this was not the case. NOW.... John Kerry has the opportunity to come forward and speak out against what happened (being that he now knows what happened). I don't mean some tiny tidbit written statement either... I mean he needs to get back on the plane and to where it took place and use his influence to make this right with everyone - in front of the cameras for all to see and hear! John Kerry needs to PRACTICE WHAT HE PREACHES and come to the aid of another American that had his freedoms and rights electrocuted in front of everyone!!! A taser is an alternative to lethal force. At no time was either one called for. He never threatened anyone verbally or otherwise. His hands were in the air and simply wanted to be heard. Good grief, the Police have this young man charged with a FELONY! In John Kerry's own statement, he said he probably could have handled it. Well, Mr Kerry..... get a grip and go handle it! We're all watching and listening.
15. GV Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 06:33 PM
Oh, for crying out loud. Senator Kerry, from all eyewitness accounts AND THE VIDEO, tried to answer the guys questions. The police chose to remove him instead. Sen Kerry did NOT see that the guy was going to be tasered, that happened in the back of the room with the kid surrounded by cops, and Kerry was on the stage in a pretty big hall. There were several options for Sen. Kerry. He chose the only responsible one. Some people really need to get a grip.
16. Marjorie G Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 06:46 PM
I repeat to all who think they know what happened: a prankster asked if he were going to get tasered, as if doing and saying what was needed to get the result he wanted. He baits and creates the scenario, and many here are determined to go along with his creation. John Kerry did not approve of the student being removed. If the student continued as out of control, the other students might have shamed him into stopping. But remember he brought the police with him. No one knew in real time how deliberate and ultertior the student's motives and actions, and he could have been a real threat charging forward. That said I wish tasers weren't used, but Kerry didn't know it happened, or was happening. (But I think most of you know that.)
17. Joy Young Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 06:51 PM
Mr. Young, I am disappointed in your post for a number of reasons, some academic and some political. You must have been in a hurry when you wrote this. It's not very good. Senator Kerry, Here is a golden opportunity for you to stand up above the rhetoric we Americans deplore. We cannot continue on this path wherein our young people are taught to be silent about important issues. Certainly you recall the tragic headline "Four Dead In Ohio" that became part of a song by Neil Young! We cannot EVER let that happen again, and this incident points in that all too terrible direction. I posted elsewhere that the man in the suit who was standing behind the student gave the "cut" signal (hand across the neck) that began the fray. HE is the source of the problem. If I were that young man's mother, HE would be the one to be served with a civil suit for violating my son's right to free speech. It is my fervent hope that the fellow in the suit answer to a judge for this. Senator, if you don't raise hell about this, I sure won't vote for you. For heaven's sake, STAND UP SENATOR!!!
18. ProSense Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 06:52 PM
Now that everyone is concerned about civil rights, can you all drum up enough outrage to repeal Bush's FISA law, or is all the civil rights abuses from repealing habeas corpus to spying on American to engaging in torture okay as long as this heckler gets to disrupt a public forum? Everyone keeps harping on the free speech aspect of this when there is none. The police overstepping their bounds is an issue of excessive force for sure, but police have nothing to do with the content of the exchange between Kerry and Meyer. This isn't about free speech, it's about removing a self-describe heckler, who became intentionally disruptive, from an event. Remember that's separate from the taser incident. He was tasered at the back of the room, kicking and screaming at that point, not at the microphone, and not by Senator Kerry. If he had left quietly or hadn't been tasered the free speech issue wouldn't even be forced into the discussion. Kerry's answers would have been heard and the heckler would still have been dragged out of the room (the police action). Oh, Lawrence be thankful you have George Bush, he sounds like your kind of guy!
19. dave Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 06:53 PM
After everything i have seen.. sorry Mr. Kerry you have lost my vote.
20. Carl Swart Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:04 PM
NO! Mr. Young. That simply will not do! I am so disappointed that I voted for this spineless piece of shit. (Oops, I cursed. Please don't let "their" police get me!) You know, ethics go a lot further than just doing what you have to. This blog entry is absolutely disgusting, and it is the reason that Democrats continue to lose. I will not vote for another Democrat until you people grow some balls. How hard would it have been for JOHN KERRY!!! to call these guys off, instead of standing up there joking. This was a real human being, and regardless of how "obnoxious" his opinions are, he has a right to express them. And if Mr. Kerry does not have time to address an honest opinion (as he seems not to have time to address this matter in person), perhaps he does not belong in politics.
21. Mass Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:15 PM
Well, it seems that the attack brigade has been sent. May be any of these people wish to tell us what they think Kerry should have done (may be after having read what happened, because some of the posts here are reminescent of FOX: facts do not matter!). I feel sorry that these people think important to spend time attacking one solid defender of our rights when the GOP Congress is busy attacking this country rights. May be this show us their priorities.
22. Rachael Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:24 PM
The trolls on this blog are dishonest and ridiculous. You are all lying about the content of the video and what actually occured because someone sent you marching orders to come here and lie. I don't believe that ANY of you ever voted for or supported John Kerry in your life; anyone can lie over the internet. "Freedom of speech" is NOT the freedom to be belligerent, rude, and disruptive. The cops should not have tasered this man but they were right to remove him, and Kerry did everything a responsible person could have done - he asked for order but he didn't presume to do the police's job for them. The right-wing Rovian trolling here is just beyond the pale - but we all know there are no dishonest depths to which swine will sink to trash JK.
23. Mass Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:25 PM
Just to make myself clear: I feel sorry for the young man, but there are stories that matter a lot more and I would wish that my senator and his team would be able to focus on them (Iraq, Habeas Corpus, ...) and not to spend time on a matter where I do not see the senator's responsibility engaged.
24. Ryan K Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:28 PM
I have but one question... Why didn't John Kerry himself address the officers to leave him be, and just let him leave on his own? From the looks of it, that what he would have done. Honestly, this doesn't look good.
25. MH Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:36 PM
I am frankly quite astonished at what I am reading here. Why do those of you blaming Senator Kerry believe that he had any power to order the police to do anything? It was the responsibility of the police to handle the disruptive student. And yes, he was disruptive, if this purported eyewitness account, or this one, are to be believed. Also please note that according to the spokesman for the University who appeared on Fox News around 7:45 tonight, the event was run by a student organization, and it was one of the student organizers who asked for Mr. Meyers' mic to be cut, and for the police to escort Mr. Meyers out. Please realize that whether intended or not, some of your vitriol is falling on another student who we perhaps should presume, until proven otherwise, made their best effort at the time to do what they thought was right.
26. wisteria Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:36 PM
Wow, it is hard to believe so many people who have posted are quick to accuse Senator Kery of wrong doing, but totally ignore the antics of the student involved. I don't even have to second guess this, Senator Kerry did noting wrong or inappropriate. This was a police matter and they were there to protect the other students and the Senator. Senator Kerry did all he could do legally. He called out to the officers requesting that he be permitted to answer the addtional question from the student and the police ignored his request. Even Senator's must obey the law and show respect for law inforcement. What possibly could he have done? And, as was obvious from all the video shown- even the cropped one, the student was over re-acting. Come on, this was a staged event for the video cameras. If he would of complied with the officers requests he would not of been tazered at all. Resisting arrest whether you think you are right, is against the law. I am stunned that anyone would actually find anything to blame Senator Kerry for. He did nothing wrong. And, I have to question the motives behind some people's misplaced accusations. This was not an issue of free speech, the student butted in line and insisted that he be heard, which he was and a question answered. His behavior was irratic and beligerant, and the police reacted to possibly threatening behavior. At that point, it was a police matter and had nothing to do with free speech. Shame on those who were so quick to judge Senator Kerry, without considering all the facts. He certainly did not deserve the kind of mean spirited treatment he has received. I have to question if some of those so quick to judge him are not in fact political operatives working for other candidates or parties.
27. fedup Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:40 PM
To those in the above comments, please tell me how Senator Kerry could have stopped it ? Did any of you bother to read any of the both sides of the story? Did any of you bother to read the rules of student events at Florida University? Did any of you bother to watch ALL of the videos (not just Youtube)? Did any of you even bother to click on the above links and go to the sources before you decided to rant? Finally, did any of you participate in the event? If you answered no to any of the above, then you truly are here to do what most trolls on the internet do so well, disrupt an honest conversation. This blog has been opened for almost a year with many topics of interest and activism. Where have you been? Oops, I forgot you are probably from the same batch that came around with the "botched joke" incident, yep and you weren't here to give your support you were here to disrupt and bash. Well you had your 30 seconds of free speech and dissent, that by the way is what Senator Kerry highly agrees with, but the difference is he will listen not to one side but to both sides.
28. Lee Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:51 PM
In response to FEDUP. Yes, I have seen all the videos and all the audio. I have also read all of the police reports as posted on the University Of Florida's web site. You will need Adobe. It is the ACTUAL police reports of the officers involved. I have also seen everything on Andrew Meyers website. He may be a heckler. He may be alot of things, but in this case, he was a student wanting to be heard. He did nothing that warranted what happened to him. John Kerry did offer to answer his question. However, John Kerry did nothing else - not then - nor does he seem to have any desire to do anything about it. He is a Senator. He should stand up for this young man's rights, whether he agrees with his opinions, statements or otherwise. It's about freedom that we all are suppose to enjoy. FOR YOUR INFORMATION: "An illegal arrest is an assault and battery. The person so attempted to be restrained of his liberty has the same right to use force in defending himself as he would in repelling any other assault and battery." (State v. Robinson, 145 ME. 77, 72 ATL. 260). REMEMBER, MR MEYERS DID NOTHING ILLEGAL. The Senator needs to step up and defend Mr Meyers liberty.
29. YvonneCa Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:52 PM
Thank you... (8+ / 0-) Recommended by: Greg Greene, whometense, beachmom, snoopydawg, fiddler crabby, blueintheface, anotherdemocrat, Gaed ...BriVT, for the information. I strongly support Senator Kerry. In his statement, the Senator defended lively debate and discussion, for which he is always a champion. He expressed care and concern for ALL those involved...including the student and the police. The Senator is a man of integrity. This event does nothing to change that. I understand the Florida student's questions...they are important, and deserve answers. But this has nothing to do with John Kerry, other than he was a speaker/performer. What if this were a concert? Would you blame the musicians? Security for events is there to protect the PEOPLE in the audience...ALL of them. What if this guy had a hidden weapon that could harm the others in the audience? Wouldn't you want security to keep you safe? Although the Florida student's questions were good, he was behaving like an attention-seeking sixth grade child. In my opinion, he was having an adult 'temper tantrum', when his discussion with Senator Kerry was interrupted by campus police. Choices have consequences. The Florida student made a very loud, public choice...and he's intelligent enough to predict the police reaction. If he didn't know what to expect, he should have. I don't know if campus police handled this perfectly, but I have a difficult time seeing how it could become the senator's fault. His part was to use the microphone to try to calm the crowd...which he DID. He offered to answer the questions. He said to remain calm. He kept talking to the crowd to keep control as best one could, given the disruptive circumstances. No one could do any more than that. I am not aware of the rules for questioners at this event nor do I know this student's history with campus police. Like the Senator, however, I think lively debate is good... and it's always a shame to have it interrupted. I have attended several Kerry events where he handled similar questions just fine.And I've been to CIVIL rallies where Kerry has answered every question put to him...including the election and impeachment questions. I'm FOR civility...not tasering. Sorry for that result at your speech, Senator. I've attended a few of your public events, and you handle every one with dignity and integrity. Given the opportunity, I'm sure this one would have been the same.
30. Diane Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:52 PM
The insulting comments left on this blog don't deserve a response. ProSense @18 has it exactly right. All you self-proclaimed civil rights advocates: how do you feel about today's filibuster of the habeas corpus vote? How do you feel about the revolting filibuster of the senate republicans of the rights of soldiers? Their desire to serve their country has been turned against them by a faithless president who proclaims his love for the military and yet treats them like indentured servants. And yet you have the nerve to come over here and whine about an incident that one kid made happen during a Kerry speech. I call BS.
31. GV Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:53 PM
Ryan K, he did. This was posted from someone who was at the event. "John kerry did try to interfere with the police. at one point, police where holding on to meyers. kerry got to a point where he almost lost his composure and said officer guy. you, let him go. i do want to hear his question, i do want to hear to what he has to say. i do want to answer him. that was at the point the officers said will pull you aside to ask your question. but as he was attempting to ask his question. the officers themselves appeared to me to make themselves clear not allowing him to stay and hear the question and yelling into his ear." http://tinyurl.com/2ygxbx There was nothing else the Senator could do short of jumping the cops as they were removing Mr. Meyers and escalating the disruption into a full blown melee. That could have become dangerous for the other attendees, don't you think? Senator Kerry did the right thing. Mr. Meyers and the police did not.
32. Rachael Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 07:59 PM
RyanK, Kerry DID ask the officers to leave him alone, he DID say he'd answer the guy's question. He was heard repeating over and over "that's all right, I'll answer his question." Please read an objective summary of the incident or watch ALL the videos - then you would know that. This was nothing but a publicity stunt for Mr. Meyer - he went there with the FULL INTENT of heckling and being harassed by the cops: http://machinist.salon.com/blog/2007/09/19/meyer_jerk/index.html Yeah, and those of you pretending to give a shit about "the first amendment" sure aren't saying a damn thing about Habeus Corpus - because everyone knows you're here to lie about John Kerry, not because you give two damns about "civil rights."
33. MH Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 08:07 PM
I see on my post above, post #25, my second link to a purported eyewitness account didn't post for some reason. Here is the link: http://tinyurl.com/39f9m4 Here is an excerpt from the account at that link:
The disturbance did not begin with Andrew asking the question. He caused quite a scene by bursting into the room in the middle of Q+A, rudely interrupting Kerry answering another question (what was supposed to be the last one), and demanding to be heard. The cops followed him in (I have the feeling he had been giving them a hard time outside as well) John Kerry responded by asking him to calm down and wait his turn, that his question would be answered next. As some of the videos show, his question was long and rambling without much focus, less of a question if you will than an outburst. John Kerry remained calm, tried to guide him to the direct question he would like answered, but Andrew continued. After Accent cut his mike off, the cops tried to guide him out and as you can all see the real event began. I was sitting in the back row of the auditorium- less than 5 feet from where he was restrained and ended up being tasered. (you can see my green shirt next to my friend in the striped shirt on most of the videos) He WAS NOT handcuffed yet when they did it. He was still attempting to get up and resist the police officers and would not put his hands behind his back. Within close range, I have to say that I didn't feel it was the safest situation. I did not feel like they had him under control at all- and was scared that if he did manage to get up- he would have started getting riled up again. I personally was in a location that if he had started flailing around again- I would have been at risk.
Btw, "Accent" referred to in that post, is the student organization that ran the event. I am afraid those students must feel terrible about this. Thanks, Andrew Meyer - are you happy?
34. BostonGirlsRock Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 08:11 PM
Lee: That is one of the dumbest explanation I have ever read. This guy comes screaming into the middle of a hall, interrupts someone in the middle of a question, yells his fool head off and creates a public disturbance loud enough for the event organizers to call campus police and that this is somehow Sen. Kerry's fault?
That is moronic. This man is old enough to get into college, old enough to devise a way to make a public nuisance of himself, old enough to figure out how to get on tv, then he ought to be old enough and mature enough to take the consequences. If he hadn't been crazy and had actually tried engaging in civilized dialogue like everyone else in the hall, he might have heard the answers to his questions.
Free speech doesn't mean that you have the right to cut everyone else off because you feel that your questions are somehow purer than theirs. This kid acted like a jerk, prevented others from speaking and ruined a public event. I hope the University expels him. I can't see how he is in any way an asset to that college or someone that should be bragged about in admissions brochures. He is a boorish, selfish, self-important jerk. He doesn't stand for free speech; his actions are those of someone who wants to prevent it.
I think you should consider picking a better role model. This kid's actions show him to be nothing but a jerk, a publicity hound and an public nuisance. I hope he learns from this incident and grows up.
35. Herb Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 08:14 PM
Thanks Brian Young, it is nice to know that not only are his public appearances scripted but so is his blog. Is his server realy that small?
36. Sandy Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 08:34 PM
The auditorium was not an unlimited public forum, like a quad or other open space. The college can make rules regarding conduct in the auditorium, and even an invited speaker can be removed. Most certainly an uninvited one can as well. The student was asked to leave when he made remarks regarding bl*w jobs and S&B. He clearly resisted. The law is settled on this. "..The 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in ACLU v. Mote (2005) and courts within the 5th Circuit have found college campuses to be limited public forums. This means that they are not traditional public forums such as public streets or parks available for anyone to use at any time, but have been opened to the public for limited use. Usually in such instances an individual or group must reserve time to speak and may speak only in designated areas. When a speaker does not follow the institution’s policy concerning uninvited speakers, he can be prohibited from speaking and asked to leave the campus. AND ..in a case concerning an uninvited speaker, Bowman v. White. The court ruled that specific parts of the University of Arkansas at Fayetteville campus were considered an unlimited public forum..." SCOTUS Rulings Campus Speech http://www.firstamendmentcenter.org/speech/pubcollege/topic.aspx?topic=campus_speakers
37. John Phillips Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 08:38 PM
It seems in recent years Mr. Kerry's efforts on behalf of our party has time and time again hurt our party; including his knee-jerk concession of the 2004 election. But also he seems to pop up hurting the party from time to time. Could he just be re-focused to being a Massachusetts senator instead of a gadfly that time after time provides our opponents with grist for their mill? How could he let this person's constitutional rights be teasered right under his nose? I simply do not believe his statement that he didn't understand what was going on, and if he didn't I shudder to think what kind of president he would have made. Please, ask Mr. Kerry to stay home, take care of his constituents and leave the campaign to the candidates. "Pub" this!
38. ProSense Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 08:43 PM
The Senator doesn't need to defend him. He's not the guy's lawyer, shrink or daddy. The guy is a jerk, and the world's full of jerk. It's not in the Senator's job description to defend jerks.
39. Jim Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 08:50 PM
It's a shame that Kerry stood by while a student was being tortured with electricity for exercising his right of free speech. And then this site is censoring their blog. What I mean is that my first post to the original blog was never posted. I'm not really expecting this one to be posted. "We’ll be posting a lot of them as the day goes on, though we’ll be weeding out the redundant ones and those that were just too rude or crude to be pubbed" Shameful
40. fedup Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 08:51 PM
Actually John Phillips it's knee jerk responses like yours that have nothing to do with the party but everything to do with bashing a member of our party. WTF does this have to do with a campaign? Sheesh, the monsters are coming out of the cellar.
41. beachmom Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 09:00 PM
Mr. Phillips, It appears you seem to be sadly uninformed as to how much Senator Kerry has done for the Dem party. The grassroots efforts he undertook for the 2004 election brought about a not well known result on the state level: more legislatures changed hands to Dems that year. That baseline achievement created a bigger bench of Democrats who can run for federal office down the line, and lead to a progressive agenda on the state level across the land. Another less known fact is that Kerry's investigations of CIA drugrunning, Iran/Contra, and BCCI most definitely helped Bill Clinton win the election in 1992. Because the then Vice President Bush was linked to those scandals, it led to bad news for the president, including, if you may recall, on the eve of the 1992 election. Finally, it was John Kerry's leadership on Iraq in 2006 when he called for a timetable for withdrawal and pushed the issue to a vote, that helped the Democrats solidify their anti-Iraq War cred for the 2006 election. He also gave or raised more money for candidates than any other Dem during that cycle. I know that here in Virginia, that money was a big deal for Jim Webb, as it helped him in the primary and kept him going pre-Macaca as well as the end of the campaign push. It seems to me that people should not react so emotionally to a one or two day media story that actually had little to do with Senator Kerry, and more to do with the University of Florida. It certainly will not affect the 2008 election for Dems; that I will guarantee you.
42. Alan Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 09:08 PM
An elderly diabetic confined to bed calls for medical assistance and gets cops who taser him. A wheelchair bound middle aged woman gets tasered ten times and dies. Armed DEA officials "raid" pain management clinics, hurl 90 year olds dying of cancer out of their wheelchairs sending their drips flying, and handcuff them on the floor as "drug addicts". Perhaps the brutalization of America has something to do with having to rationalize reports of Iraqi children being raped in front of their parents as an officialy sanctioned form of torture, and similar? Please remember that many modern Germans are tormented by guilt, despite being born over 40 years after the fall of the Third Reich - and their grandparents knew less about what was going on than modern Americans do. You do not want to leave your grandchildren with such a wretched legacy, but that means having the courage to make conscious, wise choices at this critical time (as the American people have fact done) and then action them. The student's debating style was not good, but his points were.
43. Rachael Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 09:09 PM
John Phillips, what a MORONIC thing to say. As if Kerry had ANY control over this idiot bursting in, making a fool of himself, and then getting arrested. If you were walking down the street and someone got beat up across the street from you, would it be your fault? What an idiotic thing to say. You trolls are really stretching the limits of credulity in your intense effort to smear Kerry. And Jim, you really need to look up the definitions of "torture" and the "First Amendment" - apparently your idea of "freedom of speech" is the right to make an ugly scene whenever you want wherever you want.
44. ProSense Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 09:27 PM
Jim, breaking the rules isn't a free speech issue. Removing someone who is being intentionally disruptive is not a free speech issue. Surely you don't think yelling fire or bomb in a crowded theater is free speech? Only a moron would think that. Free speech doesn't give a moron the right to create chaos. If a moron chooses to become a nuisance then that moron should be prepared to accept the consequences of his/her actions. There are rules, remember those?
45. Rachel Lucas Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 09:34 PM
John Kerry should be ashamed of himself, and so should anyone who thinks that asking a difficult question is an arrestable offense. I lived in England for 20 years, and I can tell you that the USA is NOT free in comparison. There is NO free speech when politicians can stand idly by while a student is tasered for asking why he is being arrested. The audience should be ashamed for standing by while this happened. People, wake up. When politicians can cordon off areas and call them "free speech zones", as Bush and Hilary Clinton do, then there IS no free speech. I thought this entire country was supposed to be a free speech zone. HA HA
46. Tobin Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 10:02 PM
Jim is right. It is a shame that Senator Kerry did nothing to assist a person having their rights violated infront of his eyes. Command presence is not just exercising authority by writ of law. I am hesitant to consider leadership that would let this happen.
47. Karynnj Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 10:05 PM
I am shocked at all the people who have been fed some idea that Mr Meyer was demanding answers to tough questions and was mistreated because of this. What appears clear from the longer videos is that he was distruptive and out of control. He wanted to hi-jack the forumn and create a disturbance. He was already in trouble with the police when he ran up to the front of the room, but Kerry asked the police to let him ask a question after the person he was then answering. Given this opportunity, he initiated a pompous rant - when he finally got to the first question, he prevented the Senator from answering it by continuing his rant. This was not a person in search of answers, this was a person out to create a disturbance. When the police moved to evict him, Kerry tried to defuse things by saying that he would answer the kids question - the police ignored him - and they had the power to remove him, Rather than walk out calmly with the police, he started struggling and screaming out various things. At this point, it was the police removing a disruptive person. That was all Kerry saw. He likely thought Meyer was taken out of the auditoriom. What I suspect is that video is NOT reality. There were 700 people there - to see Kerry, not Meyer incidently. These were his fellow students - all of them were closer than Kerry was. None of them were blinded by the stage lights. There is a dog that didn't bark - there was no uproar from these students. I know it's not the 60s, but this does say something. The main thing it might say is that most saw the police as restraining an out of control disrupter. It was wrong to taser him, but I doubt many people there even knew he was tasered. From the distance of the stage, I bet that even if you knew where to look you could not have seen the police use the taser. The video was filmed following Meyer. What is seen on that video is not what was seen from the stage. On the tape, Kerry's voice is heard but is sometimes hard to hear. THe Senator has a powerful voice and he was speaking into a microphone. If it was hard to hear Kerry's voice as recorded by a video camera that was between where Kerry was and where Meyer was, the volume of Meyer's cries as heard on stage (a longer distance than Kerry to the camera) would likely be at a much lower volume - likely lost in the crowd noise. Also consider that that video was the one Meyer made sure was created, was on his web site, and was linked to by the Miami Herald within hours of the event. It has also been alledged that Meyer has a history of filming things to call attention to himself. To me, it seems that Meyer went to the Kerry speech with two goals: to call attention to himself and to disrupt. Though I don't think he should have been tasered, he is not the real victim here. The victim ia Senator Kerry, who took time out of a busy schedule to give what was quite likely one of the excellent speeches he has given on Iraq and national security. He was willing to let a troubled student ask a question and was willing to answer it. For that, he is being slammed for actions by the university and the police he had no control over.
48. Diane Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 10:41 PM
Final word goes to Jon Stewart: "It was obviously a combination of police overreaction and student douchebaggery." End of story.
49. Michele Temple Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 10:56 PM
I watched the video and your account and excuses about the behavior of the student are weak. WE have rights of free speach and John Kerry will not fight to defend. Isn't it funny that the student was accusing Kerry of being weak and Kerry showed the student then and there just how weak Kerry really is. A presidential candidate that would not defend himself when attacked by right wing bulldogs,,, we all sat in amazement. This was the fighting hero from Vietnam? Why doesn't he fight now. I watched Kerry on Meet The Press on Sunday and appreciated his strength of argument but unfortunately the video of this incident that Kerry did nothing to stop---FREE SPEECH----- is the legacy John Kerry leaves to the world. Get out of this party John Kerry and let the student with the guts to challenge this police state take your place because he has courage you have long ago lost.
50. Jeanne Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 10:57 PM
You guys criticizing John Kerry all got to be republicans. I've decided I don't like blogging, it is too easy to say anything. Real change takes real work. Sen. Kerry is out there working hard to bring an end to the Iraq war and successfully lead the democrats to a strong and smart strategy with a deadline. Sen. Kerry would never discourage free speech; most of you guys are just too young to know.
51. B. Brown Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 11:02 PM
I am so utterly disturbed by what happened at the University of Florida but I have to tell you that I am more so disturbed at John Kerry's representatives on his blogs and their ridiculous explanations for it. I do not care what the premise was or the excuses being used by the president of the university, Bernie Machen, or even the pathetic blog I just read on John Kerry's blog moderated by Brian Young - that student did not deserve to get tasered so to hear justification for it by the president of the university and by the John Kerry people just makes me realize why voting for John Kerry in 2004 was a very big mistake. He is part of the same police state mentality as the president who stole the election. I have met John Kerry and I have volunteered for him in the past not only for his presidential run but for his senate race in Massachusetts. I am embarrassed and ashamed at his total lack of engagement while that student was being arrested and then tasered. I've viewed every youtube video and believe that it wouldn't matter one bit if the student was considered to be obnoxious for rushing the mike or whatever other lame excuses were used by the establishment as justification for the incident. It was wrong. And John Kerry and UF President Bernie Machen are using the same tactics that the Karl Rovian presidency of this Bush administration have used in justifying the suppression of the rights of Americans in this supposed free country. These are the dangerous beginnings of a police state and John Kerry is part of the elite and therefore must endorse it. I can't speak for UF president Bernie Machen but after listening to his comments on Tuesday regarding the arrest of one of his own students, I suspect that they are all part of the pathetic attempt at keeping their own power intact at the absolute expense of what it right. It's disgusting and I'm ashamed to have contributed money to John Kerry's campaign and to have voted for him and to have stood up for him as a real American. That student could have been escorted out of the auditorium but struggled against doing so because he, like many of us, could not even imagine that he would be arrested and then tasered for speaking out in a climate where the mainstream media wouldn't dare ask or even allow the kinds of questions that he put forward. I am ashamed of my foolishness for neither John Kerry or Bernie Machen care about the free exchange of ideas in what is supposed to be a free society. It looks like the Bush presidency, for all its failures, has had a profound impact on the values of our society and shame on all of you for succumbing to its vile grip on our freedom to voice what no one in the corporate paid for media will air. Shame, Shame, and more shame. I'm taking my campaign contributions to a real proponent of American values. And by the way, my brother will be on his third tour to Iraq this December so please don't give us any more patriotic sound bites about what a great civil disobedient soldier John Kerry was. Henry David Thoreau would not be proud of his latest failure to protect the right of a student in his company to ask something that we all would like to know the answer to. And if John Kerry read Greg Palast's book then what is his excuse? We would all like to know. You've all sold your souls for position and power. It's pathetic. Sincerely, B. Brown Massachusetts resident New York University student
52. Lee Says:
September 19th, 2007 at 11:49 PM
BOSTONGIRLSROCK: You wrote: This guy comes screaming into the middle of a hall, interrupts someone in the middle of a question, yells his fool head off and creates a public disturbance loud enough for the event organizers to call campus police and that this is somehow Sen. Kerry's fault?" ---- Ok, first, you need to get the facts straight. This guy (Andrew Meyers) did NOT "come screaming into the middle of a hall". He stood in line for more than two hours to ask Kerry question(s). He was acknowledged by Senator Kerry when he moved to the microphone once Kerry said he would take another question. Meyers began by complimenting and thanking him for his time and recommended a book in which Kerry stated "I have it and I have read it". So, He did not come screaming in and he did not interrupt anyones question. Kerry had completed his answer to the person before acknowledging Meyer. Secondly, Meyer did not "yell his head off" until the police were interrupting him and then dragging him away. Third, as for the "public disturbance", this was caused due to the actions of the officers. Fourth, as for "calling the campus police", no one called them. They were present from the get go. Last, you ask if all that is Kerry's fault? Well, if the facts were as YOU put it, the answer would be no. However, your version of the REAL FACTS are not even close to the actual facts. The reason this is what it is, is due to the actions of the police and the inaction of a Senator, be it may that Meyers may have gotten excited, with every reason to do so. The bottom line is, the student, Andrew Meyers, did NOTHING illegal, was wrestled to the ground, jolted with 50,000 (fifty thousand) volts of electricity, with at least one cuff already on his arm and six officers holding him down... and Kerry really did nothing to stop it. Yes, Kerry said he would answer his questions, but said or did nothing in a true attempt at stopping the injustice that was taking place. Now I am willing to accept that maybe, just maybe Kerry could not see exactly what was happening, but I am certain he could hear it. Nevertheless, it is clear by Kerry's own statement, he is NOW aware of what transpired and he should do more about it than issue a lame, brief statement. He needs to get involved just as the Florida Department of Law and the State Attorney is doing. His influence as a Senator along with his knowledge of the complete incident, he could help to alleviate a FELONY charge this young man now faces for conversing by invitation. He was not heckling nor was he protesting Kerry. I also think the organizers of this event (ACCENT) need to answer a few questions about their involvement.
53. Charbax Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 12:15 AM
Why should John Kerry not admit that he did a mistake? I think John Kerry should come forward and say he is sorry he didn't think about telling the police officers to calm down and leave the individual alone. John Kerry had the microphone, he should have shouted "Hey, stop that, let him alone, let me answer his questions". And now John Kerry should answer his questions. We still haven't heard John Kerry's answers.
54. Gerry Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 12:15 AM
I think this could have been handled better by all involved. Yes, the guy is a jerk and was obviously planning to be disruptive. But, his questions were good. What is wrong with asking why he conceded and if he is (note like Eagle Scouts and Marines they never quit being one) a member of Skull and Bones? It is not just a rant. What bothers me most is that if any person is tasered, they should be seen by a doctor (my opinion) for clearance before they are booked into jail. Their Use of Force policy states: d. Person(s) who have been subjected to the Taser, or it’s probes, shall be treated as follows: (1) Once in custody, the arresting officer shall advise Communications to have EMT/paramedics respond to the scene. (2) The officer will inform the EMT personnel that the person has been subjected to the Taser and relate the approximate time the action occurred. (3) If the probes penetrate the skin, the puncture sites shall be brought to the attention of the EMT. (4) Only EMT’s or the emergency room staff shall remove Taser probes that are embedded in soft tissue. The probes will be disposed of in a Sharp’s Container in accordance with biohazard regulations. The cartridge and remaining high voltage wires will be packaged and sealed in a paper bag and turned over to the Training Division Commander. Those police officers that volunteer for an exposure while attending Taser training in which the Taser is shot and the probes enter the soft tissue of the subject, will not require an EMT or emergency room staff to remove the probes. Taser instructors are trained to remove the probes in a safe manner and may remove the probes but only in the training environment. The student shot with the Taser will be observed for a period of time reasonable to ensure that no further medical attention is required. (5) After examining the affected person, the EMT’s will make the determination if the person should or should not be transported to the hospital. Transportation procedures to medical treatment facilities will follow Department Standards Directive 4020. (6) Members must be aware that one easily overlooked aspect of injury in shooting a subject with the Taser is that of falling from a standing position. A thorough physical examination with particular emphasis on injuries resulting from the fall should be performed by the EMT’s. (7) A transporting officer must immediately advise booking personnel upon the arrival at the jail that a Taser was used on the prisoner being booked. No where in the police report do any of the officers mention calling emt's or following this procedure.
55. Tim Hawkins Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 12:22 AM
I too am saddened that the Senator didn't react in this small, fairly peaceful gathering -- I can only imagine how he'd handle several Muslim-governed countries up in arms about something...
56. john Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 12:50 AM
The simple fact of the matter is, 3 extremely pertinant answers were asked of Mr Kerry, which, for most people, due to the lack of mass-media coverage of the needed background, would require a preface, that being that there has been serious evidence of vote-tampering in many places (I recall the day of the elections, in ohio, there were many reports, before the voting was even finished, that republican majority districts were allocated more voting machines than democratic majority districts, leading to lines in some dem. districts of 8 hours to vote) This begs the question, why did Kerry concede the election that day rather than even put up a farcical resistance to it as Gore had done (leaving out the question of the illegally disenfranchised voters that we all have heard about by this point). The second question being why Kerry has not called for Bush's impeachment. And the third question, which pretty much answers the first two, if Kerry would be honest enough to answer it, is whether or not he shares membership in the Skull and Bones society with the Bush Dynasty (GW, GHW, and Hitler's good buddy Prescott). That they are both members of this nefarious group is not wild speculation, it has been reported as fact by CBS -see- http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/10/02/60minutes/main576332.shtml If Kerry would answer these three questions, no reasonable person could blame him for the incident which followed them being asked. To not answer these three questions casts suspiscion on him. That none of the responses from him or his staff on this site even address the questions, even with the circuitous non-answers that politicians are known for, two full days after they were asked, leads me and probably most people who understand the implications that the probable answers leave, to suspect the worst. That being that, as a junior (to GWB, who was a legacy member) of Skull and Bones, a society whose members put that society ahead of even their own family, (even willing their estate to the society upon their death, with the understanding that the society will 'take care' of their family) Kerry handed the election to Bush, and this would also explain why he has made no effort to remove him from office, even though it is common knowledge that he lied to the nation in order to justify the war in Iraq. Until he answers these questions in a straight forward manner, I, and most people I know, will have to form our own conclusions, that, once one puts those three questions together, seem quite obvious.
57. Linn Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 01:19 AM
This was a college campus and John Kerry is a politician. College is a learning experience and it is not to be a place with jackbooted thugs that will silence people voicing their opinions. What lesson is learned? John Kerry was a wimp in this situation. He could not control a small lecture hall. He showed the same wimpy fortitude when he ran for president. I supported Mr. Kerry in the past. He has shown himself to be totally incompetent in this situation. It speaks poorly of his judgment. Kerry was an embarassment as a presidential canditate who wimped out on challenging the vote and he continues to be a force for nothing.
58. Marjorie G Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 01:35 AM
Why bother to come here with unwillingness to read the accounts by eyewitnesses and explanations of others? Ulterior motives to your feigned concerned for Democracy? Whether directed by others, or yourself misdirected, Senator Kerry has nothing to apologize for on this issue. You, who insult, however, need to examine your need to be ignorant of the facts offered, and reconsider your lack of respect for a decent and honorable man, working heart and soul for solutions that concern you. Please take responsibility for what you say and how you think, especially if you have friends and relatives over in Iraq who want to come home. Don't be silly and mean-spirited.
59. John Sepulveda Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 01:37 AM
Why wont Kerry answer Mr Myers questions regarding his association with Skull and Bones, and why are you presenting this young man as being a pest when he in all actuality was asking an legitimate question protected under the very same rights Kerry went to war in Vietnam to protect? Also why did Kerry not want the votes recounted when there where voter irregularities in an election that he would have won? What is really going on here?
60. Kerryvisionary Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 01:39 AM
I would like to believe that some of the people commenting here are simply ignorant or confused, but the sheer number of comments ignoring the facts and determined to misunderstand the true situation makes that impossible. I have seen comments like these at other blogs and they are clearly the comments of people with an agenda that has nothing to do with who John Kerry really is and what he really does and stands for. I love what Jeanne @ 50 says: Real change takes real work. Sen. Kerry is out there working hard to bring an end to the Iraq war and successfully lead the democrats to a strong and smart strategy with a deadline. Sen. Kerry would never discourage free speech; most of you guys are just too young to know. That is most definitely the real issue. Does anyone here know what JK said in his speech to the students at UF who really came to discourse with him rather than to disrupt the event? What answers he gave to those students who asked him real questions rather than trying to use him for their own publicity-minded ends? As far as I'm concerned, John Kerry accepted an invitation to speak to and with UF students, he did so, and when a selfish, self-confessed disruptor tried to make a mockery of the serious discussion, the Senator did everything he could to try to meet rudeness and disrespect with courtesy and respect. You should be honoring Senator Kerry for his incredible compassion and forbearance, and questioning the UF police and the legality of Tasering as a police technique. If you don't think JK would be the first to condemn police brutality then you don't have the faintest idea who he is. Do your homework.
61. Gabriel Bell Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 02:25 AM
I'm sorry to have to do this but I have to throw this guantlet down.Regarding "so he made shure to call of U of Florida police which, technically, he had no athourity to do..." Would like the sumpreme court case in number where it was decided that "local officals have authority to overrule congress and its laws and authority" In any chain of command regarding power , the federal offical, most importantly a UNITED STATES SENATOR , does in fact nullify all lower chains of command , right or wrong. As a firm states rights guy this has always annoyed me, however the fact that our federal leaders have forgotten this annoys me more. If a U.S. Senator disagrees with a street cop, The Senator wins as much as I don't like it. The Courts then decide if the Senator was wrong, and they excercise that power quite liberally. I admit in the thousands of rulings I may have missed this one but if it exists it is a violation of the constitution and an abhorrent afront to america. Senators are the 100 most powerful individuals( and it is absurd you must be reminded of this fact) in this socitey, below only 9 others in theory , but really two by the constitution. He's a U.S. Senator and in any that does not contain the Vice or President he IS the highest and final athourity. Don't take my word for it look at the above bloggers answers the majority of them agree. Before you reach for the "It's the law ,excuse" I say this a leader forces bad laws to change , and treats them with the disdain they deserve , imagine if Rosa Parks had ham-handed a "it's the law" and move to the back of the bus. Bad Laws are unconstitutional and if this technicality your speaking of is what caused the Senators inaction , then I submit this law is Unconstitutional. G. Bell
62. Disgruntled Alumni Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 03:06 AM
UF Alumni Chapters around the world are humiliated and disgusted at the attack that took place at the John Kerry Accent Forum and I don’t mean the verbal one between Senator Kerry and Mr. Meyer, but the physical one between the University Police and Mr. Meyer. I have been to many of these UF Accent sponsored events while enrolled as a student at UF where the discussions, such as the Michael Moore Forum, have become more heated that this one, and never have I seen such an extent of police force being used. What is even more disturbing to me is TWO (not all six) of the officers involved in this furor were placed on PAID leave of absence. PAID! Why such luxurious treatment is in their contract is beyond me. I am certain I did not vote in any student election to grant such a vacation for actions like this. This should be one of the first protocols to be revised during President Machen’s call for review. Additionally, the University Police Department should start interviewing more student-friendly employees who do not become impatient, reckless, or ruthless in such situations. I wonder if any of these six officers have students of their own who are in college or if they themselves even went to college. If they have/did then they would certain understand that at this age students are EXPECTED to be expressive in similar manners? Should they start tasering every Tom-Dick-and-Harry who is living this College Life?
63. Kristi Gaddy Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 03:22 AM
I am sickened by what I have just seen and this pat blog explanation does nothing to ease my mind or help me regain any measure of respect I may have had for Mr. Kerry. How something like this could happen in America is sadly becoming less and less surprising. A "democratic "leader" like Kerry standing passively by, mouthing weak and empty protests against glaring slaps in the face of our constitution is slowly becoming expected. I honestly don't know who's worse, the people who commit these crimes against America and it's citizens with knowing intent and self-serving motives or those who fail to protect us while pretending to support our rights. Aren't political "debates" by nature supposed to support the rights of people to heatedly debate? That guy was basically done making his point and I think an admiral person, worthy of a role as one of our representatives, would have demanded he be treated with the respect we should all expect even when we dare voice supposedly "unpopular" ideas that most everyone agrees with. Kerry may as well have campaigned for Bush in '04 and now I guess you've got to wonder why & who he's really working for. I think it's time we all got a little louder and more obnoxious. Signed, An American
64. Paul D. Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 03:45 AM
I AM OUTRAGED. You senators, and all other politicians are virtually impossible to talk to by the public. Joe Taxpayer (like myself) cannot really ever talk to politicians and make our voices heard to the people who are in control of our country and more so, of our lives. And now, when someone actually steps up and raises a very valid, true, and important issue; what happens? His mic gets cut, police surround him, and he's eventually taken to the ground by multiple officers and tasered. Why? Ok, so maybe the student was being obnoxious, maybe he really did cut a long line.....but neither of those actions are illegal in this country (from what i've heard, but it seems i could be wrong.) So it appears that since whoever was running this "show" didn't like the question he was asking Mr. Kerry and decided that this student's voice shouldn't be heard. WHAT HAPPENED TO FREE SPEECH?! Everyday I see more and more of these videos of UNACCEPTABLE Police behavior. It's scary to think, "hey that could have been me!" And the people in the crowd just sat there like the mind-numb cattle that they are and LAUGHED at this! Are you kidding me!? And if you look at one of the tapes closely at the end, you can see one of the officers involved in the incident SMILING and LAUGHING about it too! I am shocked that this could happen in what i used to think was the greatest country in the world. But lately, I've been pricing houses in Canada (no b.s. like this and better health care too!) I actually supported John Kerry in the '04 election, (but really only because ANYONE would be better than Georgie Boy Dubbya!) I'm repulsed by the fact that I actually voted for Kerry that year after seeing this video. He's a US Senator, you're telling me there's nothing he could have done or said to these poor excuses for police officers to make them stop their brutality? REDICULOUS!! I gotta say, after seeing this, and after the past TWO elections being frauds; I WILL NEVER VOTE AGAIN. I'm a 20-something male from Florida (that's right) and I've given up on our government and its actions, and I KNOW I'm not the only one. So Mr. Kerry if you or anyone with some kind of real power ever read this (don't worry, i'm NOT holding my breath on that, i'd surely die) APOLOGIZE to the VICTIM of this CRIME, NOW! No excuses, no "Cut and run", no dancing around the subject like you politicians do so well, The people of this country DEMAND justice!!! I want freedom, that's what I want, and that's what YOU should want. Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go to work so the government can steal, oops i mean "tax" my hard earned dollars. this is bogus, rediculous, unacceptable, repulsing, disgusting, wretched, awful behavior by everyone involved except for the VICTIM. I commend you sir, whoever you are.
65. Pedro Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 05:02 AM
"Sure, the kid was obnoxious and physically resisting, and to a certain extent, when you physically resist cops you do put yourself in a risky situation." Brian, I thought you'd spare us of your opinion? And you're obviously missing the point as being obnoxious is NO REASON to arrest someone. "There was a long line of people waiting to ask questions, and Meyer was near the back. He rushed up to the mic, butting up past many, many kids and making a scene. Apparently he’d been talking with the police and they were arguing long before Meyer ever got to the mic (reports from Florida are that they had threatened him with arrest already)." Sounds like these are some bad cops. The job of the police is not to threaten anybody. "Anyway, then Meyer started to ask his question — questions, actually, which turned into a rant before he was interrupted by the cops — and you’ve all probably seen and heard most of it in the videos by now." You claimed you were gonna spare us of your opinion. It's only a rant in your mind, maybe because you don't like what he was saying. "So, the kid kept going, JK was listening respectfully, and then the mic was cut off (either because whoever was in charge of the mic thought he was just ranting about whatever came to mind or because the U of F folks didn’t like the profanity he was using … I have no idea)" Brian, what was the profanity? I listened to the video several times and saw none. The mic was cut off when he asked Kerry if he was part of the same secret society (Skulls & Bones) that Bush is. That was no rant, it's a serious question. "The whole thing just basically … it was just a bad, bad situation, and as JK said in his statement, he’s never had anything end like that before. Maybe Meyer was rude to his fellow students, obnoxious, and physically resisting police, but you never, ever want to see anyone get tasered." More of your opinion. And none of it is relevant, even if he were rude and obnoxious it's no reason to arrest him, and since there was no reason to do so, resisting is irrelevant.
66. GV Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 06:28 AM
You know, this whole thing is starting to sound pretty well coordinated, from the entrance of self-described "born heckler" Mr. Meyer to some of the comments on this blog. Regardless, I think Mr. Meyer's problems are bigger than what happened at UF the other day. At first, I thought he was just some obnoxious guy trying to get his 15 min, but now I'm not convinced. I hope Mr Meyer gets some help. I read his bio, and it's pretty disturbing. He enjoys heckling people who are singing the National Anthem? How sad is that? Maybe this whole thing will lead to some counceling for the young man. I think his behavior may be a cry for help.
67. Willie Baracchi Says:
September 20th, 2007 at 07:21 AM
How can we trust someone in power, when incidents like this one (U.F. student,Fl.) where not interfere by Kerry itself?, he had the power to stop the police brutality by just saying so, even if the kid was obnoxious at asking questions, police brutality and depriving a Citizen for his right of speech it is not very American, to my opinion Mr Kerry should have answered any questions the kid had to make, no matter how involving or how long that answer could be, it is a Citizen's obligation to question our government, and it is a citizen's right to be answered by our politicians. I won't vote for you anymore, Mr Kerry thats for sure, I don't trust your political stands up
#
103.
September 18th,
2007
8:24 pm
I suggest publishing the police officers’ names and addresses, and then Tasering their dogs and children.
— Posted by billy bo
#
104.
September 18th,
2007
8:42 pm
Political speech is the most protected under the U.S. Constitution and these police officers — even though university police — who might be sworn to support and protect the Constitution. If an elected official, like Kerry, was engaged in dialogue with Meyer, then to my eye the police action — perhaps malfeasance under color of law — should be turned over to the FBI for action.
As Sen. Kerry said, “I asked the police to allow me to answer the question and was in the process of answering him when he was taken into custody.”
— Posted by Proinsias Faulkner
#
105.
September 18th,
2007
9:07 pm
Someone posed the question, “What’s wrong in the United States?”
Out of the ten amendments in our Bill of rights, we are down to one: They can’t quarter soldiers in our homes. Habeas corpus, which dates back to the Magna Carta and is the cornerstone of common English law, went down the tubes at the hands of the Bushies. The citizens of Lexington, Massachusetts had more civil liberties under the British Crown than we do now. All of this was in the interest of fighting terrorists. These liberties were not taken from us; we gave them away!
Do you feel safer? I, sure as hell, do not. I fear our government, or lack thereof, more than any terrorists. Maybe the American people should read a little history. Benjamin Franklin said, “They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security. ”
One final observation: A woman is pulled over for a traffic violation and is tased. An elementary student acts up in her principal’s office and is tased. An elderly woman who was visiting an elderly friend in a nursing home, refuses to leave, and is tased. Where did all of this happen? Florida, the same state where people can carry concealed firearms. Let’s not go there!
As I write, Senators Dodd and Leahey have created a bill: The Restoration of Habeas Corpus Act. The Republicans in the Senate threaten a filibuster. Let’s all of us fight for our rights again and demand passage of this bill. It will be acted upon this week or next. Let your Senator and Congressman know.
Ed
— Posted by Ed from Philly
#
106.
September 18th,
2007
9:07 pm
There is much blame to go around, but I fault the university most. As someone who works with middle school, secondary, and college aged students, I recognized immediately that the police should not even been allowed near the microphone, period. It should not have been up to public law enforcement — who have no training in dealing with youth — to remove and/or discipline unruly students. Incidents like these are precisely why every major campus in the country has its own public safety department. Someone with experience in exercising authority over students, either one of the school’s own public safety officers or an educator, should have had responsibility for keeping order. Kids will be kids. Police will be police. Where were the adults who were supposed to be in charge of this event?
— Posted by David Kelsey
#
107.
September 18th,
2007
9:08 pm
I’m curious as to whether the students who sat like sheep thought this incident would have behaved any differently, if the police had, say, shot the guy rather than merely tased him.
It’s not just the decision to remove a questioner, the police behavior and Kerry droning on that’s interesting here, it’s the supine audience members who said and did nothing while the thing was going on, even though Meyer was a bit of a dufus.
— Posted by Chuck
#
108.
September 18th,
2007
9:31 pm
Well said, Russell at #22. Well said.
— Posted by Matt Kachaluba
#
109.
September 18th,
2007
9:51 pm
In my opinion that fool got what he deserved. He was acting like an imbecilic little brat and had plenty of chances to shut up and leave. Instead he wanted to put on a show for the public. My guess is the lawsuit is next and then he gets a big payout courtesy of the American Tax Payer. Absolutely pathetic. My only wish is that they had tasered his mouth shut permanently!
— Posted by sd
#
110.
September 18th,
2007
9:54 pm
The headline of the story “Instant Martyrdom…” suggests the kid cynically provoked the cops to attain this end so he can be a martyr. Appearently that is not the case, we, who went to college in 1960’s, know in certain environment cops (or National Gueards) can be very trigger happy to the extent they could shoot live bullets on demonstarting crowd (Kent State).
What I don’t understand why the NYT headlines as such. The kid was a loudmouth and without much manners but use a potentially deadly weapon on all loudmouths we will lose half the population.
— Posted by Abe Guler
#
111.
September 18th,
2007
9:56 pm
Joke 1: Kerry didn’t help the kid because he was waiting for the UN to intervene
Joke 2: the kid was correct, “he didn’t do anything”: he didn’t step away from the mike, he didn’t put his hands behind his back, he didn’t get on the floor …
:)
— Posted by vinny
#
112.
September 18th,
2007
10:52 pm
This video is a fraud. You can clearly see that his arm is being held by one of the cops when the ows start. How in the hell is it possible to tase one without tasing anyone else attatched to the same person, skin to skin? This is all over blown and way out of hand, but the tasing did not happen. I’m pretty sure a bit of over dub did. You can clearly hear the sound cut completely off and then back on around the time of the supposed incedent heightening also. The AP version clearly shows the guys arm being held by another while the supposed tasing is occuring so you all and myself have wasted alot of our time here. lol
— Posted by Jane
#
113.
September 18th,
2007
11:35 pm
Andrew has a history of making a disruptive splash.
Since he got what he wanted. Let it go. I predict
Mr Meyer will grow up and end up responsible like Barry Freed. Abbie had to do the acting out bit as a youngster.
Don’t judge Andrew Meyer too harshly
Tom Roundhouse
NYC
— Posted by Thomas Roundhouse, Sr.
#
114.
September 19th,
2007
12:17 am
KERRY DID INTERVENE!
SEE FOLLOWING EXCERPT FROM AP STORY
As two officers take Meyer by the arms, Kerry, D-Mass., can be heard saying, “That’s all right, let me answer his question.”
Audience members applaud, and Meyer struggles for several seconds as up to four officers try to remove him from the room. Meyer screams for help and tries to break away from officers with his arms flailing at them, then is forced to the ground and officers order him to stop resisting.
As Kerry tells the audience he will answer the student’s “very important question,” Meyer yells at the officers to release him, crying out, “Don’t Tase me, bro,” just before he is shocked by the Taser. He is then led from the room, screaming, “What did I do?”
— Posted by DCharney
#
115.
September 19th,
2007
3:11 am
John Kerry should have stopped the police, allowed the kid to finish off his soapboxing, thanked the kid for being such a diehard supporter of his presidential bid, and then moved on to the next college kid with a question.
If this incident shows anything, it shows that John Kerry is not really cut out to be President, and frankly, he probably should not be a Senator either. There was no reason for this kid to be wrestled to the ground, zapped with electrical shocks from a Tazer device, while Kerry looks on and doesn’t do a thing to stop the police from abusing a kid essentially for being an annoying questioner. This man, John Kerry, has sworn to protect the US Constitution?
John Kerry invited this kid to ask him a question at a public forum in a public university. When the cops felt he had worn out his welcome, they proceeded to manhandle him. When he wouldn’t be dragged out without an explanation of what laws he had broken, they piled on top of him and hit him with electric jolts.
The US Constitution has died another little death today. John Kerry should be ashamed of himself.
— Posted by aaron
#
116.
September 19th,
2007
5:52 am
The fact that Sen. Kerry and Andrew Meyer were conversing with each other, i.e., having a dialogue, not an argument, not a stand off, when the police dragged Mr. Meyer away mid-sentence to arrest him shows that the police violated Mr. Meyer’s first amemndment rights at the most basic level. Who is going to charge and prosecute the police? That the police used tasers on someone who was loud but not out of control and of no danger to anyone demonstrates the utter incompentence of the police. By using tasers in a situation like that, the police are saying “we don’t know what to do, we’re frightened.” And they’re stupid, violent loosers that make a mockery out of a free and democratic society. Why do we put up with this crap?
— Posted by Gregg Low
#
117.
September 19th,
2007
5:59 am
It is an outrage that this arrest took place in the United States of America. When freedom of speech is suppressed in America, it is an event that is heard around the world. Regardless of what questions were asked or what side of the political aisle you are on, the arrest of this student signals a dark turning point for America. America has reached a crossroads. Either we will be serious about civil rights and our Constitution, or we will trade it for security and runaway government. It is clear from the video that the student felt his freedom of speech was being repressed and did not understand why he was being taken into custody. He was not even read his Miranda rights and some of the witnesses claim he was already handcuffed when he was “tazed”. Arresting him under these circumstances was a criminal act that betrays the core values of every American.
— Posted by Mike
#
118.
September 19th,
2007
6:11 am
That was so funny, like Bill O’Rielly said, this guy (Meyers’) is the biggest wimp in the country, and as Dennis Miller said “he thought the police went a little overboard but it really made his day”. My word, It’s nice to see these idiots that want to grow up to be another liberal mouthpiece squirm every once in a while….really made my tuesday when I saw it……Andrew Meyer, you are a wimp and an idiot (oh, and a lousy actor too)!
— Posted by Scott
#
119.
September 19th,
2007
7:51 am
We saw a similiar thing with the forceable removal of an 80 year old man at a labour part conference. NO tasers though, in this situation the US is really going to an awful extreme. Its part of the same horrifying move away from democracy, and indeed, at least Meyesr will get the comfort of minor matrydom when most victims of police brutality and censorship suffer in silence. WAKE UP INDEED the ‘free’ western society is indeed becoming an Orwellian nightmare. You americans at leaat have the power to try to vote someone vaguely acceptable in. I need not say who clearly needs to go…..
— Posted by AngryBrit
#
120.
September 19th,
2007
8:20 am
Glad they took him down. He should have been clubbed.
— Posted by Matt Sanchez
#
121.
September 19th,
2007
10:16 am
We have free speech in this country, not free disruption. If you see all the videos and read all the details about what happened before the cameras were on him, you can tell this whole thing was an act:
1.Barging to the head of the line near the end of the question/answer session to rudely get ahead of everyone else,
2.Handing his camera to another student to film him before he started,
3.The campus police trying to get him to “play nice” and follow the rules for the event, etc
–all of which is not on any of the videos– you can see that he wanted to be as disruptive as possible.
Then the things that you DO see on the videos show more blatantly how he wanted to “blow this up”
4. He wanted to filibuster during his 3 questions.
5. Yelling and getting defensive when the police turned off his mike and were trying to escort him off the stage. (Remember folks, this was AFTER the he had already made a spectacle of himself by doing things not shown in the video.)
6. Refusing to just calm down. That would have done more to stop the “evil Police Brutality” then anything else.
7. Saying “their giving me over to the government” and “their going to kill me” “Would you ask about the guy they arrested at the protest cause they’re going to try to kill me!” (Oh pleeease…How melodramatic can you get?)
This was not free speech folks. This was rude, bad manners at the least or more like pre-meditated upstaging at the most. This was all about him. The Andrew Meyers show. He WANTED to rile the cops into arresting and/or tasing him. He kept goading them from the very beginning. “What, you’re going to arrest me?” No, we want you to leave since you’ve already cut in line, taking more than the time you should, showboating for the crowd and you’re being so disorderly. If you have a problem with that and keep turning up the volume you just might have some consequences and yeah, then we will probably arrest you.
Anyone who thinks this is a free speech issue has forgotten that you can’t falsely yell fire in an auditorium. Granted, he didn’t yell fire, but he did hijack the event, turning it into the Andrew Meyer show instead of what the event organizers had planned.
America is slowly forgetting how to be civil at a public event.
I’m being kind to Andrew Meyer to call this a pre-meditated stunt. If this was not pre-meditated then I have to call it moronic stupidity. He had to be a total self-centered idiot to not know the common bounds of politeness in a public forum. Fighting for free speech indeed. More like fighting for free “it’s all about me!”
— Posted by Jim
#
122.
September 19th,
2007
10:24 am
Can’t believe the people who were taken in by this scam. This guy was not going to stop until he created a really big scene. He intended to make a video that would get a lot of hits on youtube. He didn’t even want his question to be answered.
Angry Brit, you and many others, have been taken in by a prankster. It’s called self promotion.
— Posted by Sharon
#
123.
September 19th,
2007
10:36 am
John Kerry was less than outraged by this police event! Did anyone hear him shouting at the police to leave Andrew Meyer alone? John Kerry should have left the moment the police took down Andrew. John Kerry’s protest could have carried the day. It’s hard to watch a candidate who is so “cultered” and “respectable” that he loses his own voice. Mr. Kerry should be out front for Andrew Meyer all the way to the resolution of this travesty.
— Posted by PATRICIA
#
124.
September 19th,
2007
10:39 am
Florida has a strong tradition of using tasers in schools and against children (not that I group the university student in the child category); why is anyone surprised? A simple google search will turn up scores of incidents in which police tasered children and teenagers. There’s even an instance where they tasered a 6 year old.
America, what has happened to you?
— Posted by michael
#
125.
September 19th,
2007
10:40 am
My first viewing of this scene was a bit of a shock and I hated what the cops were doing. However on repeated viewings, Meyers does appear to be obnoxious and out of hand and not conforming to the rules for asking questions. And really, he isn’t politely asking questions, but yelling at Senator Kerry. When told his time was up, he was belligerent to those in charge and kept yelling. Because of the manner in which he kept waving the book and asking very difficult questions concerning voter fraud and secret societies and why Kerry conceded the election, this scene appears to be more of a publicity stunt for Palast’s book that happened to get out of hand. Sorry folks, but when you are allowed one minute to to ask questions and you try to take over the meeting by yelling and bullying those in charge, you are going to get ushered out. If you want to fight with those who have peacefully asked you to leave, as he did with the young women, you are going to get forced out by the big guys, as he was. If you want to thrash around and fight and resist arrest, as he did, you are going to be charged with resisting arrest. If you refuse to be handcuffed and keep fighting with the officers, you are going to get zapped. Without some controls, meetings such as this would be a complete free for all. This is not a political issue; it is a matter of common courtesy. His behavior was totally out of control and he deserved the zapping he got. Zapping worked, for he then allowed them to handcuff him, which is standard procedure in such cases.
— Posted by Skeptic
#
126.
September 19th,
2007
10:43 am
When a child wants attention, they do what it takes to get it. He got his attention. Old news. Let’s move on.
— Posted by Cetric
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127.
September 19th,
2007
10:48 am
Don’t tase me, bro! Police brutality! Rodney King!
No, this guy wasn’t an instigator. And surely this martyrdom was unexpectedly thrust upon him. After he became disruptive, it’s not as though the police attempted to escort him in a civil manner from the event. I mean, they jumped him from behind and tased him without warning, right?
The fool deserves any supposed “Police Brutality” in this instance. If he had been respectful and civil with his questions, there would have been no issue. Had he walked calmly from the event as requested, he wouldn’t have been tackled. Had he stopped struggling after being tackled, he wouldn’t have been tased. This guy is a disruptive attention hog.
— Posted by Eric
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128.
September 19th,
2007
10:50 am
#112 Jane said:
“This video is a fraud. You can clearly see that his arm is being held by one of the cops when the ows start. How in the hell is it possible to tase one without tasing anyone else attatched to the same person, skin to skin”
Nice try. Tasers, and in this case we’re talking about a stun gun, do not shock people that happen to be touching the individual being shocked, nor can they disseminate their charge through water or a similar medium.
If you think about it, stun guns can only be used in hand-to-hand situations anyway, so they would be practically useless if they shocked someone in contact with the individual being stunned.
— Posted by Kit
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129.
September 19th,
2007
11:17 am
The decision to cut off the guy’s microphone wasn’t Kerry’s to make. It’s difficult enough simply to stand up and answer questions at a forum, without running the forum as well, and running the forum wasn’t Kerry’s responsibility. Those who are attacking Kerry here are just looking for an excuse to attack Kerry. This was between Meyer, the cops, and maybe an organizer who asked the cops to intervene.
— Posted by ducdebrabant
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130.
September 19th,
2007
11:18 am
The fact is that a taser weapon is that: a weapon. The manufactures themselves state that they are NOT to be used casually and only as a one step resort before using a gun. Police in America are trained to use a taser before even using mace in some communities. Poorly trained, most officers think it is amusing to taser a suspect. The USA is one of the only Western nations in the world that allows citizens to be tasered with the rest classifying it as domestic torture.
— Posted by Chuck P
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131.
September 19th,
2007
11:30 am
This country needs a hell of a lot more Andrew Meyers if we have any hope of living in a country where we are free and where the government is held accountable- which we do not have anymore, and it’s getting scarier all the time. I read all of the posts before watching the video- I thought I was going to see Andrew do something really truly horrible- but all he did was confront Kerry, albeit sarcastically, on some points that I wish I could have heard the answers to!
What actually did Andrew do that was so out of bounds for a thinking and feeling college student? He was asking the questions that a lot of other people should have been asking a long time ago and I applaud him for having the guts to raise some awareness from the country’s collective slow decline towards brain-death! Yes, he was disruptive, but regardless, the police were totally out of order to tase him- this is what you would expect out of a totalitarian police state- not from the ’supposed’ freedom-lovin’ US of A. And as for the rest of the students there, what a bunch of passionless sheep! Pathetic! Once we’ve given away all of our freedoms it will be a hell of a lot harder to gain them back. Wake-up America!
— Posted by jj
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132.
September 19th,
2007
11:43 am
1. Andrew Meyer is a loser.
2. When John Kerry said he’d answer the question he should have been allowed to stay.
3. The cops were right to remove him.
4. The cops should NOT have tasered him.
5. John Kerry should have stepped up to the plate to intervene and so should have by-standers.
THIS IS THE SOCIETY WE LIVE IN? ONE WHERE WE GET TASERED FOR DISAGREEING?
— Posted by AnusJuice.com
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133.
September 19th,
2007
11:50 am
I noticed that in the blog, there is no account of what led to the incident in question, only the incident itself, and the aftermath. Everybody here is making judgements based on an incomplete report of the events.
Also, here’s a description of the effects of a taser (from Wikipedia): “Electroshock weapon technology uses a temporary high-voltage low-current electrical discharge to override the body’s muscle-triggering mechanisms. The recipient feels great pain, and can be momentarily paralyzed while an electric current is being applied. It is reported that applying electroshock devices to more sensitive parts of the body (such as the testicles and nipples) is more painful. The relatively low electric current must be pushed by high voltage to overcome the electrical resistance of the human body. The resulting ’shock’ is caused by muscles twitching uncontrollably, appearing as muscle spasms. However, because the amount of current is relatively low, there is considered to be a ‘margin’ of safety by a number of medical experts. Experts generally agree that this margin is highly dependent on the overall health of the person subjected to the shock. Usually, the higher the voltage, the more effective it is. It may take several seconds to subdue a subject with 100 kV, but only about a second with 1 MV (1,000 kV).
According to the many sources, a shock of half a second duration will cause intense pain and muscle contractions startling most people greatly. Two to three seconds will often cause the subject to become dazed and drop to the ground, and over three seconds will usually completely disorient and drop an attacker for at least several seconds and possibly for up to fifteen minutes. TASER International warns law enforcement agencies that ‘prolonged or continuous exposure(s) to the TASER device’s electrical charge’ may lead to medical risks such as cumulative exhaustion and breathing impairment.”
If he had been tased for several seconds (while shouting “Don’t tase me bro.” and “OWOWOWOWOW”), he would have likely been dazed, and gone limp, and certainly not have been able to struggle further.
— Posted by Adam
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134.
September 19th,
2007
12:06 pm
Holy crap! And I thought I was liberal. You’re an idiot if you support what Andrew did and come down on the police. There’s protocol to follow. This is about disorderly conduct and resisting arrest. Get the scoop before crying “the sky’s falling!” The term Martyrdom in this case is so blatantly sarcastic and most of you didn’t get it. I’m ashamed to be a Democrat.
— Posted by Chad
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135.
September 19th,
2007
12:15 pm
It seemed obvious that he intended to be disruptive, especially with what has come out since the incident. He intended to be filmed. He kept talking without giving Kerry a chance to answer. He WAS asked to stop and step away (I could hear it on the video); he was asked to leave - he kept shaking the people off and continuing to yell.
People are giving this way too much attention - just what he wanted.
— Posted by Linda
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136.
September 19th,
2007
12:21 pm
Meyers is a rude, obnoxious jerk who provoked the police. He did resist arrest, he asked for the Taser, and he got it. And his mouth ran non-stop throughout the incident.
What about everyone else’s freedom to speak at the forum? I guess only Meyers had an opinion.
— Posted by Anna
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137.
September 19th,
2007
12:23 pm
For those here who continue to indight Kerry for not doing anything… please try and remember that he was at the FRONT of the auditorium and the fracas took place at the BACK of the auditorium. Who the heck can see the detail that even the incompetent camera person caught as the camera waggled and flopped from one subject to another??? Why is anyone dumb enough to think that Kerry could see exactly what was going on so he could base an appropriate response?? For #51 claiming to be “A True Conservative”: don’t you mean “A True Nazi”? Only three or four replies in this forum even suggest the writer understands the meaning and intent of the American Constitution. Yeah, we probably need to start packing and find an island somewhere that hasn’t had the blessing of “freedom” yet bestowed upon it, so we can be free once again, boorish or not, for a little while.
— Posted by Ric C
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138.
September 19th,
2007
12:31 pm
Some relevant Court Rulings:
“When a person, being without fault, is in a place where he has a right to be, is violently assaulted, he may, without retreating, repel by force, and if, in the reasonable exercise of his right of self defense, his assailant is killed, he is justified.” Runyan v. State, 57 Ind. 80; Miller v. State, 74 Ind. 1.
“These principles apply as well to an officer attempting to make an arrest, who abuses his authority and transcends the bounds thereof by the use of unnecessary force and violence, as they do to a private individual who unlawfully uses such force and violence.” Jones v. State, 26 Tex. App. I; Beaverts v. State, 4 Tex. App. 1 75; Skidmore v. State, 43 Tex. 93, 903.
“An illegal arrest is an assault and battery. The person so attempted to be restrained of his liberty has the same right to use force in defending himself as he would in repelling any other assault and battery.” (State v. Robinson, 145 ME. 77, 72 ATL. 260).
“One may come to the aid of another being unlawfully arrested, just as he may where one is being assaulted, molested, raped or kidnapped. Thus it is not an offense to liberate one from the unlawful custody of an officer, even though he may have submitted to such custody, without resistance.” (Adams v. State, 121 Ga. 16, 48 S.E. 910).
“Citizens may resist unlawful arrest to the point of taking an arresting officer’s life if necessary.” Plummer v. State, 136 Ind. 306. This premise was upheld by the Supreme Court of the United States in the case: John Bad Elk v. U.S., 177 U.S. 529.
— Posted by Ben Wood
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139.
September 19th,
2007
12:51 pm
#134, dear Chad… don’t be ashamed. I seriously doubt that anyone here supports what Andrew did. Yes there is protocol, and this is SUPPOSED to be a University which, for those who have never been to one, means a place where you can say pretty much what you want, and be either supported or put down by your peers. Certainly, it is not supposed to be a place where you are put down by police, just for being a jerk. As for being ashamed, I am far more ashamed for being a Republican than you could ever be for being a Democrat.
— Posted by Ric C
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140.
September 19th,
2007
12:55 pm
…and Matt, #120, who would you like to come to your aid, when they club YOU for doing nothing much other than being a jerk?
— Posted by Ric C
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141.
September 19th,
2007
1:36 pm
I’ve read all the posts here and can accept the various points of view. Hostile behavior, especially when cops are involved, and with lots of yelling for help is shocking and we feel for who think is the victim. But this guy was totally lacking in humility, he enjoyed being a loudmouth and bully, and he was promoting Palast’s latest book–perhaps looking for an internship. Palast, who rightly criticizes bad behavior within our government is wrong for defending this guy’s bad behavior. The impossible to answer question he asked Kerry about why he conceded so quickly has a simple answer. The democrats were smart enough to know that taking over and trying to clean up the mess created by the Bush administration was suicidal for, for the democrats would then be blamed for not fixing everything. I knew Hillary would wait this one out. Though I voted for Kerry, I hoped Bush would win and bring down the whole Neocon movement, which is doing quite nicely. I don’t know why Palast can’t understand this What is truly amazing is how we ignore the real important issues and focus our attention on this self-promoting loudmouth. It is the same strategy Karl Rove and George Bush use, only there are not cops to stop them.
— Posted by Wayne M
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142.
September 19th,
2007
2:32 pm
Kerry should simply post detailed, specific answers to the questions posed in order to kill any (real?) conspiracy theories and suggestions that he’s scared to answer the questions. I’m sure he must have a website/blog…
— Posted by RussD
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143.
September 19th,
2007
2:43 pm
Your analysis of the taser is inaccurate Adam. Current drives voltage, not the other way around.
Step that current up a bit and it could easily be fatal.
This was an obvious case of inexperienced police officers over reacting to a situation that they wanted to control. Instead of deesculating the situation, which is the most desired outcome of any encounter, they escalted something that could have been and should have been, very easily handled.
First off there was no need for the officers to put their hands on Andrew. I too, would become a bit agitated if someone were to place their hands on me, especially if I were posing no threat to the speaker or those assembled. It is human nature to resist unnecessary force. Once the officers started dragging Andrew away, they never gave him an opportunity to comply with their directions. He even told them that if they would just get off of him he would walk out.
It was a police power struggle.
Other students were right to not get physically involved. Had they done so, they too could be charged with a crime. Andrew was not being harmed, other than his pride, he was being inconvenienced.
— Posted by DN
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144.
September 19th,
2007
2:46 pm
Being overly disruptive and annoying = Taser?
Wow, G.W.’s really had an effect on this country, hasn’t he?
— Posted by Michael Gusella
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145.
September 19th,
2007
2:50 pm
This has nothing to do with supporting Andrew Meyer’s actions! It has to do with a blatant use of force where one wasn’t necessary! As long as Meyer was not endangering anyone (and being obnoxious in this case is not endangering), a taser should never have been used. Regardless of whether you believe he “deserved” it for his intentions, the fact of the matter is the boy was on the ground, being held down by a group of officers, and there was no need for such a use of force. If a cop shot Larry the Cable Guy in the head, it would make a lot of people happy, BUT DOES THAT MAKE IT RIGHT???
— Posted by Michael Gusella
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146.
September 19th,
2007
3:16 pm
For those of you who are not used to seeing people being arrested, the standard practice is for the person to lay face down and put their hands behind their back to be cuffed. If you refuse to obey the cops and want to yell and fight with them, you will usually regret it. The reason it can require five four or five cops is because in America they must subdue the guy without the use of fists, knees, or clubs. There is nothing new here and our lame president, George Bush, has had nothing to do with it. Freedom of speech can only exist where there is some semblance of control and order. Andrew Meyer’s obnoxious behavior took away the freedom of speech for everyone else in the auditorium, including a US Senator, while he gained all the attention. He was given ample opportunity to get control and quiet down, but he refused and insisted he was going to continue to monopolize the floor. When they cut his mic he didn’t let up. It is people like Meyers who cause the cops to become involved in our lives.
— Posted by Wayne M
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147.
September 19th,
2007
4:29 pm
“Your analysis of the taser is inaccurate Adam. Current drives voltage, not the other way around.” - Posted by DN
DN, are the effects of the taser accurate though? (P.S. That was Wikipedia’s description, not mine.)
— Posted by Adam
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148.
September 19th,
2007
5:32 pm
America, where are you?
Where is “…this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom — and that government of the people, by the people, for the people…” when having a public discussion with a Senator (paid by the “people”) will grant you to be electrocuted by the police (also paid by the people!!!).
Any public official, Senator or policeman, should remember that they are in their position because of us, the people, and we not only have the right to publicly scrutinize them but it is our duty.
Like it or not, we are becoming numb, content as long as nobody bothers us in the day to day life, and in the process we are loosing our precious democracy.
You would expect this event in Cuba or China, not in the World’s Beacon for Democracy.
Our Founding Fathers would slap each person that didn’t react to what was going on in that auditorium if they could…
— Posted by Ignacio from Clermont, FL
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149.
September 19th,
2007
7:24 pm
This is the worst thing that’s ever happened in the history of the world. WHAT HAPPENED TO AMERIKKKA??
— Posted by Jim Treacher
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150.
September 19th,
2007
11:27 pm
The most interesting outcome, I think, is not the citizenry’s reaction, but that of the media.
Meyer’s “Don’t tase me, bro,” cry seems to receive more ink than any real discussion of freedom erosion. But since police brutality is nothing new, I am more concerned with John Kerry’s acquiesence.
Psychologically speaking, individuals with their own websites and audacious email addresses are more likely to confront politicians than, well, a NY Times blogger. Don’t you think?
— Posted by s. jacobson
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151.
September 19th,
2007
11:32 pm
Folks, you can’t just analyze this from one slanted angle or the other, you have to look at it holistically; the YouTube videos do not show the entire event and none of those are very clear. No one hear can speak authoritatively about the event at all. But what was reported by the police, by witnesses, and the news, was that he had long gone over his time and never asked a line of questioning in the first place; he was barraging Sen. Kerry with politically charged questions and giving him no time to respond, he was just accusing him of things in the form of a question, from the transcripts, and not trying to exercise his First Amendment right to question the government. He wasn’t questioning, he was just slandering him in the forum, which is clearly inappropriate when other students are trying to have a reasonable Q&A session.
That being said, the cops had every right to escort him out of there, but not to arrest him, much less taser him, that was completely inappropriate and dangerous and they should pay for it.
No one should be in full defense of the kid, nor the cops, end of story. There is no basic freedom at question here, it’s bad judgment on both sides; the overreacting cops played right into the hands of an immature, manipulative college student.
— Posted by Ric Stubbs
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152.
September 20th,
2007
1:58 am
On my blog I do a detailed legal analysis under Florida law of the issue:
Should the UF police who attacked Andrew Meyer on Constitution Day be tried for Attempted Murder?
http://pleasedonttasemebro.blogspot.com/
Read the blog and vote.
As far as what he should have done? http://FlexYourRights.org has a great instructional video, BUSTED, you can find on YouTube. In my opinion, every citizen should be thoroughly trained by that video. Would make my work defending alleged criminals, like the officers or Mr. Meyers, a lot easier.
— Posted by jonahtrainer, J.D.
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